Which way to go on 454 TBI build?

**DLV555** · 02-20-2019

Hello, I've got some noob questions.
I've got a '94 C2500 w/ a 454 that I've made some mild upgrades to. It should be vastly better than stock and will definitely require some tuning to make the most of it, but is still on the mild side. I've had TBI vehicles for years but never got into the tuning. I'm finally going to do it. I was dead set on an EBL as I wanted to go that route on my old Firebird a decade ago but never did, and that car is long gone. I had since forgotten that the EBL is not built to handle an electronically controlled transmission. At first that didn't deter me and I was ready to run both the EBL and PCM in tandem. That, however, leaves out any transmission tuning without also doing some work on the stock PCM in addition to engine tuning with the EBL.|
SO, does anyone have any advice in regards to choosing between the EBL and the '7427 PCM? Pro/Cons? Does either provide superior results? Cost difference? For a truck that will do mostly towing and work truck stuff should I even care about shift points and so on? Is it any easier to buy the equipment and tune the 7427 vs installing an EBL?

**dave w** · 02-20-2019

One option is to use a Moates.net Ostrich 2.0 (Chip Emulator) https://www.moates.net/ostrich-20-th...eed-p-169.html

The emulator will make the 16197427 "Flash", just like EBL.

dave w

**DLV555** · 02-20-2019

Originally Posted by dave w

One option is to use a Moates.net Ostrich 2.0 (Chip Emulator) https://www.moates.net/ostrich-20-th...eed-p-169.html

The emulator will make the 16197427 "Flash", just like EBL.

dave w

Fascinating. How does it stack up against the EBL at that point?

**dave w** · 02-21-2019

The EBL vs. 16197427 using an Ostrich 2.0 are equivalent (no chips), upload / download a tune with TunerPro RT.

The EBL offers Auto Tuning.

The 16197427 does not Auto Tune.

Tuning the 16197427 with TrimAylzer: http://fbodytech.com/trimalyzer/trimalyzer-download/ is a good (low cost) tuning option.

dave w

**sturgillbd** · 02-21-2019

Also EBL will not control a 4L60/80E..... Would have to piggyback the EBL along with the 7427 to keep E-trans control. EBL supports boost. Pros and Cons with either choice.

**DLV555** · 02-21-2019

Originally Posted by dave w

The EBL vs. 16197427 using an Ostrich 2.0 are equivalent (no chips), upload / download a tune with TunerPro RT.

So is the Ostrich 2.0 a permanent install? Leave it in and flash as you wish? I know nothing of these devices but am intrigued.

Originally Posted by sturgillbd

Also EBL will not control a 4L60/80E..... Would have to piggyback the EBL along with the 7427 to keep E-trans control.

That's exactly my issue. I like the EBL at face value because of the ease of tuning with the VE learn and HUD, but it has no control for E transmissions. So even with an EBL I need to retain the 7427, which isn't a bad module to begin with.

**steveo** · 02-21-2019

fueling tables are the easiest thing you'll ever tune, even if you just do it by hand by reading your data logs. auto tuning or VE learn or whatever is pretty cool to have on board if you don't want to learn how to tune at all.

second vote for trimalyzer to tune your VE tables from log data, the guy that wrote that really knows what he's doing .....

the EBL wont help you tune your timing tables, idle, power enrichment, accel enrichment, dfco, injector constants, etc. those procedures will be the same whether you use EBL or any ol' ecm with a normal programmable chip in it.

the ostrich is an emulator, so it pretends to be a chip and the ECM will think everything is normal, but lets you manipulate tables live. for a mild build like yours, you barely need something like an ostrich. just take some logs and burn some chips. it's not that much work to open an ECM and swap a chip out, and with the tools and knowledge in this forum, it'll probably only be 4 or 5 tries before you get it pretty close. i wouldn't keep an ostrich running a daily driver or anything, not that they aren't reliable, i'd just prefer a real chip in there.

**steveo** · 02-21-2019

from ostrich faq:

The Ostrich is NOT designed to be left in an engine bay!!! It will fail prematurely if exposed to the heat of a bay. It is designed for a maximum operating temperature of about 80C (175F).

The Ostrich is NOT designed to be exposed to moisture!!! It will fail prematurely if exposed to liquids. It will fail prematurely from condensation inside its case.

If you are going to use the Ostrich in harsh environments, try to do so for short periods of time and then program a chip for long term use. We recommend this in general but it is especially important in harsh environments.

Due to its internal battery constantly powering portions of the device, the Ostrich can easily be ruined by condensation caused by sudden drops of temperature in humid environments. Returning the Ostrich to a cool (~50-77F / 10-25C) , dry environment after exposure to high humidity before attempting to use again is a very good idea. Placing it in a sealed bag with dry rice or another desiccant can help if condensation is suspected.

**DLV555** · 02-21-2019

Originally Posted by steveo

from ostrich faq:

I read that so that's why I asked.

Good notes, and good points on tuning.
Is the Ostrich of use for real-time tuning, then using the data to create a bin?

**steveo** · 02-21-2019

with an emulator like that, you're real time tuning the bin itself which is loaded into the emulator (so just press 'save' and there's the bin)

**myburb** · 02-21-2019

I have a 94 2500, mild modded 454, 4l80e. PCM is 6395 and 7427, they both seem to work the same. If your motor is only minor modded l would just stick with the gm setup. I did a bunch of data logging and chip burning. Mostly experimenting to learn how it works. The last couple of years I have done nothing to computer and it has been reliable, reliable. It pulls a trailer way better than stock. Runs much smoother than when I got it stock.

**DLV555** · 02-21-2019

Originally Posted by myburb

If your motor is only minor modded l would just stick with the gm setup.

I'm swapping over to Gen VI heads, milled down (but I'm not yet sure how much), a Summit K1300 cam (208/218 @ .050"), headers, dual exhaust, and an Edelbrock Torker II intake. I've heard guys singing the praise of a single plane/TBI combo and I found one cheap so I'm giving it a shot. It's low-rise, so there's no air gap. I've got my '94 TBI (30 psi regulator) but I also have a set of 81lb/hr injectors from an earlier 454 unit. I'm expecting just over 9.0:1 compression. My goal is to maximize pulling power and fuel economy. This should be a significant bump up from stock, I'm fairly certain the stock tune will run it, but I doubt it will be anywhere near what it could be.

**DLV555** · 02-21-2019

Originally Posted by steveo

with an emulator like that, you're real time tuning the bin itself which is loaded into the emulator (so just press 'save' and there's the bin)

So, then do you just remove the emulator when you're done?

**dave w** · 02-21-2019

Originally Posted by DLV555

So, then do you just remove the emulator when you're done?

After "Tuning" is complete, there are two options:
1. Keep the Ostrich 2.0 installed.
2. Remove the Ostrich 2.0 and installed a chip programmed with the "Tuned" Flash (aka .bin file) downloaded from the Ostrich 2.0.

dave w

**DLV555** · 02-21-2019

Originally Posted by dave w

After "Tuning" is complete, there are two options:
1. Keep the Ostrich 2.0 installed.
2. Remove the Ostrich 2.0 and installed a chip programmed with the "Tuned" Flash (aka .bin file) downloaded from the Ostrich 2.0.

dave w

Ok, cool. Makes sense.
Those are currently backordered on Moates.net. Since I have none of this equipment, the APU1 kit seems to be an all-in-one package with a cable, emulator, programmer, etc. Would that be a good place to start? Or more specifically, would that be have all the equipment I would need for this endeavor? Minus (apparently) a memcal adapter and a ZIF.