Bringing TBI and Multi Port Fuel Injection to a New Level.     EFI Conversions and Tuning! Seattle to Portland! E-mail Tuning Consultant!
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 20

Thread: 127730 with DIS

  1. #1
    Fuel Injected!
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Age
    39
    Posts
    25

    127730 with DIS

    Hello

    Since I build in a 3.4 V6 in my 1990 Firebird, I'm thinking for using the DIS that came with that engine.
    The engine runs great now, but has not enough power in the high Revs.
    Found some wiring diagram to connect the dis to the wiring of the firebird, but still have some questions....
    Hope someone here can answer them..

    - Do I need another Bin file?
    - Are there changes to made on the bin file I have?
    - Or does it works like that without changes...

    configuration at the moment:
    3.4 V6
    TH700r4
    1227730
    Bin with $88 mask


    grtz, D

  2. #2
    Super Moderator Six_Shooter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    2,857
    Yes, there are changes needed, to offset the trigger/EST by 60* (relative to crank).

    There are a couple threads on here that explain the different ways to go about doing this.

    Alternatively you could start with a bin that was used with DIS originally, such as the ones from the 1987 to 1994 Cavalier, though early bins could also have MAF enabled. Typically people use $A1 for this because it seems to be a little more refined than $88 and was the last mask that GM used for this application IIRC.
    The man who says something is impossible, is usually interrupted by the man doing it.

  3. #3
    Fuel Injected!
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Age
    39
    Posts
    25
    Thanks..

    Will the A1 work with the 700R4 transmission?

    and maybe a stupid question, but offset 60.... will that mean that if I switch the spark plug wires, i don't need to change a thing?

    grtz, D
    Last edited by D Max; 10-08-2017 at 01:59 PM.

  4. #4
    Super Moderator Six_Shooter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    2,857
    Quote Originally Posted by D Max View Post
    Thanks..

    Will the A1 work with the 700R4 transmission?

    and maybe a stupid question, but offset 60.... will that mean that if I switch the spark plug wires, i don't need to change a thing?

    grtz, D
    Yes, both the 700R4 and the TH125C have TCC control from the ECM and nothing else. So you will need to start with an automatic bin.

    No, just changing the spark plug wire around won't work, because there is drastically different timing needs between starting and running when it comes to the DIS system. When the engine is starting base timing is used, but once above (usually) 400 RPM, timing control switches over to the ECM that will then change spark timing.

    Also degrees between spark is 120*, not 60*, the offset is to do with the ESC signal that controls timing, and without that correct it just doesn't work right.
    The man who says something is impossible, is usually interrupted by the man doing it.

  5. #5
    Fuel Injected!
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Age
    39
    Posts
    25
    Today, I installed the DIS.
    I used this wiring diagram:DIS_wiring_chart.jpg

    I used the pickup coil, original on the 3.4 engine.

    I get no spark.

    Someone that can give me a 'golden' tip?

    grtz, D

    EDIT: Guess I was a little bit too fast here.....
    I have a 24x crank sensor on the engine....
    Any Idea how to connect this one?

    grtz, D
    Last edited by D Max; 10-11-2017 at 01:38 PM.

  6. #6
    Super Moderator Six_Shooter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    2,857
    I thought this was a RWD 3.4? Those only ever had a 7x sensor.

    You can literally just connect power, ground and the CPS to teh ICM and get spark. The other 4 connections to the ECM are yto send RPM reference and timing control signals between the ICM and the ECM.

    So if you have no spark, make sure that your ignition power, ground and CPS connections are good, both when the key is just on and while cranking.
    The man who says something is impossible, is usually interrupted by the man doing it.

  7. #7
    Fuel Injected!
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Age
    39
    Posts
    25
    I guess it will come down to the cps connections then....

    It could be 7x, i did not take off the harmonic balancer to count it.

    The connector of the CPS has 3 wires.
    As I found on the internet, A should be 12v, B is signal and C would be ground.
    The connector on the ICM has also 3 connections, but only 2 are used.
    In the WD I posted, it says 2 for the signal, the third would be the shield....

    grtz, D

  8. #8
    Super Moderator Six_Shooter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    2,857
    Wait... are you trying to use the 24x crank sensor behind the harmonic balancer? If you are that's the wrong crank sensor. That's part of the "quick fire system" and RPM reference for the ECM, but won't work with the DIS system. (I kinda forgot about this one lol)

    You want the CPS that's installed in the block about mid way on the passenger side.
    The man who says something is impossible, is usually interrupted by the man doing it.

  9. #9
    Fuel Injected!
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Age
    39
    Posts
    25
    I looked at the engine block, and the bunch of wires that came with the block, and indeed, it makes a lot more sense.....

    This sensor has only 2 wires, and they have the same color....
    Did not know there are 2 sensors.....

    I will try tomorrow to connect it properly, and then try again...

  10. #10
    Fuel Injected!
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Age
    39
    Posts
    25
    Today, I got the ignition working.
    The engine runs quite good, but the ECM throws the code 42...
    I also have no tach.

    I do have a tach signal in tunerpro....

    Still work in progress..

    grtz, D

  11. #11
    Super Moderator Six_Shooter's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    2,857
    Code 42 would mean that the tan/black wire is not connected, or not connected to the right circuit.
    The man who says something is impossible, is usually interrupted by the man doing it.

  12. #12
    Fuel Injected!
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Age
    39
    Posts
    25
    Did some troubleshooting today......

    This is what i all did:

    checked all the connections, and they are like they should be on the wiring diagram above...
    Measured the bypass wire between the the DIS and the ECM => it is not interrupted
    Checked the advance with the strobo => it is 4 at idle, and goes to 12 at about 3000rpm.
    It does not make a change if the bypass wire is disconnected.
    (that 4 is a indication, since there was no reference point on the 3.4, and I fabricated one myself)
    Swapped a ICM with an ICM I have in stock => no difference
    Swapped a ECM => no difference

    So the problem still exist: No tach and throws code 42
    Last edited by D Max; 10-22-2017 at 04:32 AM.

  13. #13
    Fuel Injected!
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Age
    39
    Posts
    25
    for the moment, i came to the following conclusions:

    the ECM gets a reference signal from the ICM (=> fuel injection works + tach signal in Tunerpro)
    The 4 wires between the ICM and the ECM have a near zero resistance.
    The ECM does not put 5v on the bypass, but sets code 42 instead.
    Try to find an oscilloscope, to check the signal on the white wire (est)


    someone with any ideas?

    grtz, D

  14. #14
    Administrator
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Lakes Region, NH
    Age
    48
    Posts
    2,794
    Faulty module or ecm, or wire for bypass may be in wrong spot at ecm connector?

  15. #15
    Fuel Injected!
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Age
    39
    Posts
    25
    bought myself a third ICM today.
    Connected it => same problem
    Seems not logic that 3 ICM's have the same problem, and nobody seems to have had the same issue.....

    tested the tach with a pulse generator => it works

    @ 1 project2many: nothing changed to the ECM, I guess I do not need to change wires to it when swapping to DIS? Or do I....

    grtz, D

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •