Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 37

Thread: IAC logic "Topic of the week 2/19/12"

  1. #1
    Fuel Injected! PJG1173's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Jacksonville NC
    Age
    50
    Posts
    641

    IAC logic "Topic of the week 2/19/12"

    This is a subject that I have tried to find some information on for a while. I have searched for information on how to adjust this to respond better to an engine with a bump stick with little success. There is plenty of info out there about the IAC and how it works but nothing really jumped out at me. Being so new to tuning a lot of what I have read is Greek. I found the following article informative but not sure how to apply it. http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm/papers/747iac.txt One of the things that irritates me about the TBI system is when you blip the throttle it takes so long to idle back down (compared to a carb). Searching for IAC in the parameter finder in the $0D ADX results about 30 or so settings some of them are self explanatory others well not so much. One question I have is while looking at some of these tables I see a lot of them relate to % of airflow. How is this calculated since it is not a MAF? How does the PCM know how much air is flowing through the engine? Obviously the addition of a cam and head work has increased airflow so how do you reflect this in the tune?
    87 4Runner, 15" spring lift, 3" body, chevy vortec 355, 5.29 gears, 38.5x15.5x15" Boggers, 280hr, 16168625 running $0D
    93 S10, 36x12.5x15 TSL's, custom turbo headers, 266HR cam, p&p vortec heads, $0D Marine MPFI with 8psi boost.
    05 Silverado, 2' lift, 4" exhaust, Bully Dog programmer,

  2. #2
    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    North Idaho
    Age
    63
    Posts
    10,477

    1227747 IAC logic Idal Air Control

    There's a few settings for Idle Speed Decay. These are built in to cause what is happening, you are not liking. They are to prevent snapped back throttle that produces higher emmissions. Since they are mostly msec settings I don't see much there other than help it not stall. The one that stands out on the bin I looked at was "Time until Initial Idle Speed Decay" set to 3 seconds! I think I'd try that one first at 0...

    Here's the IAC logic paper linked to above specific to 1227747 but gives a good idae of all the things built into IAC logic. It is also in our Fuel Injection Write up Section.
    1227747 ECM IAC Control

    Robert Rauscher
    10/14/2000, updated 12/4/00

    Copyright 2000, Robert Rauscher, All Rights Reserved.

    This is specific to the 747 ecm. However, the methods and madness
    applies to many of the GM ecm's. (Use at your own risk, no guarantee
    that any of this is correct.)

    Note:

    Values such as 0x22D are eprom table addresses. These you
    can easily change.

    Values such as L0004 are RAM variables. These are used by
    the ecm during it's processing.


    INTRO:

    IAC is the abbreviation for 'idle air control'. This is a little
    misleading, as many external factors affect how the IAC reacts. Along
    with controlling the idle speed, the IAC is in use while cruising and
    accelerating. It is used in the anti-stall process and the DFCO
    process. As part of the fueling routines, additional fuel is added
    whenever the IAC is retracted.

    Not all IAC control parameters are covered here.


    WHAT THE IAC IS:

    The IAC itself is an electro-mechanical device. It is a linear stepper
    motor with a cone-shaped pintle attached to the end of the control rod.
    This pintle is moved into and out of an orifice that bleeds air around
    the throttle blades. This orifice is generally about 5/16 of an inch
    in diameter.

    The IAC position and control are measured in steps. One step moves
    the pintle a small amount. The full range is typically from zero
    steps to two-hundred steps. Zero steps are when the pintle is fully
    extended, closing off all IAC bleed air flow.

    As the steps are increased, the pintle is retracted from the orifice,
    allowing more air to bypass the throttle blades. This has the effect
    of increasing the engine speed. Remember that an IAC retract (or an
    increase in steps), opens the air passage to raise the engine speed.


    BASIC OPERATION:

    With the engine off, the IAC will be at the park position. This is
    the position used upon cranking the engine. Once the engine starts,
    the ecm will start to move the IAC to another position. This position
    is from a table lookup of steps vs. coolant and a baro correction.

    However, the IAC does not move to the new position immediately. If it
    did, the engine would react suddenly, possibly stalling. The difference
    between the original park steps, and the newly desired steps vs. coolant,
    are lag filtered. These filters control the rate at which the IAC moves.

    Once the IAC has moved to it's new position, the idle logic starts to
    act. The goal here is to attain, then maintain, the desired idle rpm.
    Is does not matter whether the engine is in closed loop or open loop,
    the idle logic takes over.

    A key here is: As long as the current idle speed touches the desired
    idle rpm plus the idle error term, within the time delay, no change
    to the idle speed will take place. If the idle goes outside of the
    limits, the IAC will be moved to compensate.


    Now that the engine is idling, sooner or later the driver will hit the
    gas. Now the throttle follower logic kicks in. As the tps% increase, so
    does the IAC steps. Again, this action is lag filtered. As the throttle
    is then closed, the IAC retracts, lag filtered.

    Upon the engine being shut off, the IAC goes through a reset process. The
    IAC is stepped to the reset position, stepped to the zero position, then
    stepped to the park position. This calibrates the positioning of the IAC,
    along with leaving it in place for the next cranking to start.


    There are additional factors that affect the IAC position. If the battery
    voltage dips, the IAC can increase the idle. The A/C turning on, or
    decel fuel cutoff (DFCO), can affect the current IAC position.

    For an idea of how these factors can work, I'll use the A/C turning
    on as an example. With the engine at IAC controlled idle, and the A/C
    turning on, additional steps are immediately added to the current IAC
    position. Another table value also adds to the desired idle rpm. Lets say
    the desired idle rpm went from 800 rpm, to 850 rpm.

    The steps that were added, are decayed out. However, the idle logic
    is also attempting to hold the idle at the newly desired rpm. An astute
    driving may notice a slight increase in idle, along with a dip in idle,
    as the new idle speed is attained by the ecm.


    TABLES and PURPOSES:

    The following values are the eprom table addresses.

    0x293: Additional fuel added during IAC opening. (val = msec * 16.384).
    Acts like a pump shot (Do not use as one.)


    0x5C1:


    0x5C2: IAC park position. IAC is immediately moved to this position
    after engine stop and IAC reset completion. This is the IAC position
    for engine cranking and start.


    0x5C3: Park to run delay. Delay from engine start, to the IAC moving
    to the run position: IAC vs. coolant. (val = seconds * 40)


    0x5C4: Stall saver cut-in rpm (rpm / 12.5). If the engine rpm drops
    below this value, the IAC is further retracted according to the steps
    in the stall saver table at: 0x60A, four lines, lookup by baro. This
    action is immediate and not subject to lag filtering.


    0x5C5: Stall saver cut-out rpm (rpm / 12.5). Once above this rpm,
    the above added steps are decayed out (lag filtered).


    0x5C6: %tps for idle threshold. Used in conjunction with a hardcoded
    0 mph. These two values define whether the engine is in idle or not.
    If engien is not considered to be in idle, no idle speed control
    is attempted.


    0x5C7: Time delay for small error IAC retract. (desired idle too low)
    0x5C8: Time delay for large error IAC retract. (desired idle too low)
    0x5C9: Time delay for small error IAC extend. (desired idle too high)
    0x5CA: Time delay for large error IAC extend. (desired idle too high)

    The past four entries are used to slow-down, or delay, the operation
    of the IAC at idle. When in closed loop idle, the IAC attempts to
    maintain the desired idle. The error term is the difference between
    the desired idle rpm and the current engine rpm.

    A larger error term has a shorter delay, to move the IAC quicker. Once
    the idle is close, the delay is longer. This is done for better control
    of the idle speed.

    If the engine idle oscillates wildly, seems like the IAC can not
    'keep-up', increasing these values (slightly), may correct it. Note
    that an oscillating idle can also be caused by incorrect VE% and SA
    tables.


    0x5CB: Rpm breakpoint for large error retract (rpm/12.5).
    0x5CC: Rpm breakpoint for large error extend (rpm/12.5).

    These past two entries are the rpm breakpoints for the previous four
    IAC error time delays.


    0x5CD: Idle deadband (rpm/12.5). Amount of idle variance allowed within
    the time delay (0x5C7 - 0x5CA). More than this amount will cause the
    IAC to respond, affecting the current idle speed.


    0x5CE: IAC reset steps. Upon engine stop, the IAC is retracted
    to this position, moved to zero steps, then parked at park steps (0x5C2).


    0x5CF: Additional startup steps when A/C on.


    0x5D0: Minimum IAC differential steps with A/C on. (?)


    0x5D1: Maximum IAC differential steps with A/C on. (?)


    0x5D2: IAC shutdown voltage (Volts * 10). If vehicle voltage drops
    below this value, the IAC is no longer stepped.


    0x5D3 & 0x5D4: DFCO steps. Number of steps to add to IAC whenever DFCO
    is in effect. Will not be decayed out until DFCO is no longer in effect.
    This status is from the fuel routines. Uses decay filter coeficient @ 0x5EA.
    Note that this is a double byte value. The actual steps are in 0x5D3, with
    a fractional amount in 0x5D4. So set 0x5D4 to 0.


    0x5D6: Added steps for A/C on. These steps are immediately added upon
    the A/C being switched on. They are decayed out, with the idle control
    logic maintaining the desired idle.


    0x5D7: Kickdown delay timer value (seconds).
    0x5D8: Kickdown steps.

    These two together form a post-startup rpm reduction. The kickdown
    delay timer starts right after startup. Once the timer has expired,
    the IAC is extended by the amount of kickdown steps.

    A nuance: The kickdown steps must be less than the steps used in
    the IAC position vs. coolant table value (0x5F5): Otherwise kickup
    will occur. The kickdown steps are subtracted from the IAC position
    steps, and are added to a term that is decayed out.


    0x5D9: IAC steps subtracted from current idle position when placed
    into gear (auto).


    0x5DA: Additional idle speed, added to desired idle rpm when A/C on.
    (rpm / 12.5).


    0x5DB: Idle rpm for closed loop aldl diag mode (rpm / 12.5). Used
    for troubleshooting.


    0x5DC: IAC retract steps for vehicle voltage drop.
    0x5DD: Vehicle voltage drop required (Volts * 10).

    Whenever the vehicle voltage drops by the value in 0x5DD, the IAC
    is retracted by the steps listed in 0x5DC. This is intended to
    bump up the idle to maintain alternator output.

    As long as the vehicle voltage drop IAC bump is in effect, the IAC
    steps will not be decayed out.


    0x5DE: Maximum IAC steps. This is the maximum retract steps allowed.
    (Except for engine stop reset).


    0x5E4: Low VSS filter coefficient.
    0x5E5: Medium VSS filter coefficient.
    0x5E6: High VSS filter coefficient.

    These filter coefficients are used to slow the throttle follower action
    of the IAC. When IAC position calculations are made, it is not advisable
    to immediately move the IAC to that position. Instead, the action is lag
    filtered to control the speed of the IAC action.

    There is one of three filter coefficients used depending upon the vehicle
    speed. A higher value has less filter action, increasing the IAC speed.


    0x5E7: IAC extend delay, low vss (seconds / 5).
    0x5E8: IAC extend delay, high vss (seconds / 5).

    Delays IAC extend after an IAC retract command. Can cause a 'rpm hang'
    after a throttle blip or throttle lift.


    0x5E9: Decay filter coefficient. Used when DFCO not active.
    0x5EA: Decay filter coefficient. Used when DFCO is active.

    These filters are used to decay out IAC step increases due to items
    such as the battery volt drop, DCFO, hot restart retracts, and kickdown.

    0x5EB: Fast decay filter coefficient. This filter is used to decay
    out the stall saver step increases.


    0x5EC: Low VSS threshold (mph * 3.2).
    0x5ED: High VSS threshold (mph * 3.2).

    These are the VSS thresholds used to define which filter coefficient
    to use. Selected from the values at 0x5E4 - 0x5E6, depending upon VSS.


    0x5EE: Minimum IAC throttle follower steps when above Low VSS. Whenever
    the vehicle speed is above the mph defined at 0x5EC, the IAC TF will not
    step lower than this value.


    0x5EF: Minimum TPS% required for throttle follower IAC steps.
    0x5F0: Percent of throttle follower in park/neutral (for auto only).
    0x5F1: Percent of throttle follower not in park/neutral (also manual).
    0x5F2: Maximum throttle follower in steps.

    As the throttle opens, the IAC is retracted. As the throttle closes,
    the IAC will extend. The speed at which the IAC extends following the
    throttle is controlled by the filter coefficients at locations:
    0x5E4 - 0x5E6, dependent upon the VSS.

    The throttle follower value along with the filter coefficients affect how
    the engine returns to idle after the throttle is closed. This includes
    both a return to idle on a throttle blip, along with affecting ease of
    shifting (manual tranny). Note that the throttle follower IAC retract
    steps are not filtered. The IAC opens as quickly as the throttle in opened.


    0x5F3: A coolant temperature value for a cold kick down enable? Used
    to enable the use of the values @ 0x5E1, 0x5E2 & 0x5E3.


    0x5F4: N-bias. The first time this speed is exceeded, the current IAC
    count in L00CC is added to L00CB. I am not sure of the intention of this.


    0x5F5: IAC position vs coolant temperature (in steps). Seventeen line
    table versus coolant. From hot ( > 136C), to cold ( < -8.5c). After the
    engine starts, the IAC is decayed from the park position to this
    position, with adjustments.

    These adjustments can include: A/C on, baro, low battery.

    I have found that it is better to set the IAC position vs. coolant
    values a little on the low side. This allows the rpm to drop below the
    desired idle speed, to then be 'caught'. Otherwise, it seems as though
    the idle never drops down to where it should be.


    0x606: IAC position vs baro at reset (in steps). 4 line table, added
    to the IAC position vs. coolant lookup. Do not set this table too low,
    it appears to have something to do with how much idle adjustment can
    be made.


    0x60A: Stall saver IAC increase vs baro (in steps). 4 line table.
    Whenever the idle drops below the stall-saver speed (0x5C4), the IAC
    is immediately retracted by this table value. Once the rpm rises above
    the stall-saver cutout speed (0x5C5), the added steps are decayed out.
    The stall saver decay filter coeficient is at: 0x5EB.


    0x60E: Desired idle rpm versus the coolant temperature. Nine line table,
    from 55c to 135c inclusive, in 10c intervals. Value is rpm / 12.5.

    This is the end goal, the rpm at which the engine should idle. I have
    found that the table range is a bit on the high temperature side. When
    running cold aluminum manifolds, there may be little difference in the
    desired idle speed between 55c and 65c coolant.


    MECHANICAL EFFECTS:

    (I want to thank Bruce Plecan for discovering and documenting this gem).
    With a TBI system, the IAC steps at idle can be crucial. Again, I am
    referring to the hot'r street type engines. A rumpity-rump engine needs
    all the help it can get to idle. One area to be addressed is that of the
    throttle blade setting.

    A typical TBI system will idle with an IAC count of 35 to 45. On a cam'd
    engine, zero steps may be better. Myself, I shoot for three to five steps
    with a warm engine, and no A/C. The reason for this has to do with the
    injectors residing above the throttle plates.


    During idle, the TBI injectors are designed to spray onto the bore walls.
    When this happens, the fuel runs down the walls, and past the throttle
    blades. The air speed past the throttle blades is very high. This action
    shears the fuel into vapor that is then able to travel to the chambers.

    If the engine idles with a high IAC count, this IAC air is bypassing
    the throttle blades, hindering the flow of fuel into the plenum. By
    opening the throttle blades and reducing the IAC counts, there is a
    greater volume of air drawing fuel past the throttle blades.

    Next time you are timing the engine, shine that light into the TBI
    bores, and look. Then, knock out that throttle blade adjustment plug, and
    turn it in. Just keep an eye on the IAC count, you do not want to try
    to get it below zero. This is the reason I set the idle to have at least
    a couple of counts.


    TIPS:

    When turning in the TBI idle screw with the engine running:

    Once the throttle opens past the TPS% value at: 0x5C6, the
    IAC will stop controlling the idle speed. An engine stop,
    wait ten seconds, and an engine restart will reset this value.

    It is best to turn in the idle screw, then start the engine.
    It is now possible to turn the screw out to set the minimum
    IAC counts.


    To reduce flair-up on engine start:

    Lower the park position @ 0x5C2.
    Lower the park to run delay @ 0x5C3.
    Lower the kickdown time delay @ 0x5D7.
    Lower the coolant vs. position values @ 0x5F5.


    To quicken the return to idle after throttle blip:

    Set delay @ 0x5E7 to 0.
    Increase filter coefficient at 0x5E4.
    Reduce throttle follower percentage @ 0x5F0 & 0x5F1.


    When idle speed has been raised (cam'd engines), also raise the
    stall saver speeds.


    An oscillating idle can be caused by:

    Incorrect VE% table (flatten idle area).
    Incorrect SA table (flatten idle area).
    Too fast IAC reaction, increase (slightly) the delay values
    at 0x5D7 through 0x5DA.
    Stall saver set too high (it's kicking in).
    Battery voltage varying.


    To make manual transmission shifting easier and smoother:

    Set the throttle follower filter coeficient parameters so that
    the engine rpm drop between gears matches the rpm required for
    the next gear.


    A large amount of throttle follower:

    Can help top end power as it will allow more airflow.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Random Notes:

    Loaded into L00C2 only if greater than current value in L00C2:

    0x5D3: DFCO steps
    0x5D8: Kickdown steps
    0x5DC: Battery voltage drop

    0x303: Hot bias steps if kickdown already occured.

    0x303: Hot bias steps. If kickdown has not yet occurred, this
    value is added to whatever is in L00C2.

    Note: L00C2 will not be decayed out if any stall saver is active.
    Or, throttle follower steps are active?, (in L00C6).


    The following are added together and stored in L00CB:

    Lessor of L00E4 or L00C1
    L00CE: Position vs. coolant
    L00C2: (see above)
    L00C4: stall saver
    L00C6: throttle follower
    L00CD: ?
    0x5D6: A/C adjust steps

    0x5D9: In park/neutral. Subtracted from L00CB.

    After startup, idle control starts with L00CE being adjusted for proper
    idle speed. L00CC gets incr's as L00CE decr's, and vica-versa.

    L00E4 can also be increased to rasie the idle speed.

    Vehicle has not yet moved.


    **Once N-bias mph has been reached, the value in L00CC is added to L00CB.
    L00CC is then set to zero. This can cause the engine speed to increase.



    The idle control logic will not lower the engine speed whenever:

    The vehicle speed is > 0 mph (hardcoded @ 0xF372), -or-
    The tps% is greater than the value at: 0x5C6 (* 0.3906)

    This means that the vehicle must be absolutely still for the idle control
    logic to reduce engine speed. Else, the steps are held where they are. Of
    course, the throttle follower and stall saver are still in effect.

    If the vehicle is moving, and the engine speed drops below the desired
    idle, L00CD will be increased to increase engine speed. Note that this
    does not cause a change in L00CC.


    If L00CD == 0 and L00C6 (throttle follower), > 0, then the idle control
    will not be in effect. (See F2F9). Unless stall saver is decaying out.


    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
    -= =-

  3. #3
    Administrator
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Lakes Region, NH
    Age
    54
    Posts
    3,853
    Speed density code always calculates airflow, or at least a version of an airflow number, based on the engine size, the VE tables, and the sensor measurements. That's how it knows how much fuel to deliver.

    Much of what's in the 7747 paper was old news when $0D was released. GM dumped many of the old idle routines and worked hard on making the engine idle well and behave acceptably. You'll want to look for throttle followers, or time delay to close IAC, or something along those lines. Mark may have found the right one right off the bat.

    Remember that in terms of how fast the engine reacts, timing changes are going to do the most in the least amount of time. Then fuel changes, then IAC changes. Watch your timing values to make sure they aren't contributing to the hanging high idle.

  4. #4
    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    alabama
    Age
    41
    Posts
    1,705
    Quote Originally Posted by EagleMark View Post
    There's a few settings for Idle Speed Decay. These are built in to cause what is happening, you are not liking. They are to prevent snapped back throttle that produces higher emmissions. Since they are mostly msec settings I don't see much there other than help it not stall. The one that stands out on the bin I looked at was "Time until Initial Idle Speed Decay" set to 3 seconds! I think I'd try that one first at 0...
    Nice! I will also have to give this a try, as I have had the same complaint as PJG, slow to return to idle. However mine is a little diffrent. It seems intermittent. Sometimes it drops right back down to idle, sometimes not. Sometimes when coming to a stop, it holds itself at like 1400 rpm untill I have come to a complete stop, then after a couple or few seconds, it lowers itself back to idle. Very annoying. However other times, it will drop back to idle, or just a hair above idle, long before I come to a stop (like it should) Its very strange, and I have yet to figure out exactly what makes it decide to do either/or.
    79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy

    93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver

    99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.

  5. #5
    Fuel Injected! PJG1173's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Jacksonville NC
    Age
    50
    Posts
    641
    here is one of the things that is confusing me when trying to figure what to change. when working with the ve tables, SA, etc you can datalog and figure out where in the table you are pulling from, but when your working with the IAC you get counts in your logs. looking at the attachment does not really see like it works the same. Is there a way to make tunerpro log calculated airflow?
    IAC tables.jpg
    87 4Runner, 15" spring lift, 3" body, chevy vortec 355, 5.29 gears, 38.5x15.5x15" Boggers, 280hr, 16168625 running $0D
    93 S10, 36x12.5x15 TSL's, custom turbo headers, 266HR cam, p&p vortec heads, $0D Marine MPFI with 8psi boost.
    05 Silverado, 2' lift, 4" exhaust, Bully Dog programmer,

  6. #6
    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    North Idaho
    Age
    63
    Posts
    10,477
    Quote Originally Posted by 1project2many View Post
    Remember that in terms of how fast the engine reacts, timing changes are going to do the most in the least amount of time. Then fuel changes, then IAC changes. Watch your timing values to make sure they aren't contributing to the hanging high idle.
    Never thought of that in deceleration! So I looked at timing tables in $OD and of course there are 2 Idle and Off Idle. At low RPM there is about 10 degrees more in Off Idle but higher RPM are about the same. So if his issue is a blip of throttle at Idle or what is considered to be in idle table which I beleive is a MPH setting I can't see it. now if the blip of throttle and hang time to idle was after Idle Spark table/above set MPH I can see 10 degrees that would hang it up there. Since the truck in question, is in question as to use? It looks like off roader, Idle control is a main drivebility point is slow technical manuvers so raising this MPH setting that makes the change from Idle to off idle could be a cure. IIRC Dave had said it was 2.2 MPH but that may be bin specific. In a rock crawler I could see bringing this up to 5 mph maybe more especailly if a conversion and VSS signal does not take into account transfer case reduction.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeepsAndGuns View Post
    Nice! I will also have to give this a try, as I have had the same complaint as PJG, slow to return to idle. However mine is a little diffrent. It seems intermittent. Sometimes it drops right back down to idle, sometimes not. Sometimes when coming to a stop, it holds itself at like 1400 rpm untill I have come to a complete stop, then after a couple or few seconds, it lowers itself back to idle. Very annoying. However other times, it will drop back to idle, or just a hair above idle, long before I come to a stop (like it should) Its very strange, and I have yet to figure out exactly what makes it decide to do either/or.
    Yours is a Manual trans too! So it is going to have some of these built in for emmissions (remeber dash pots) because of emmissions rise when throttle blade snaps back. Side effect was easier shifting. So your manual may be more dramatic then manual. And see above MPH from Idle to off idle sstting.

    Quote Originally Posted by PJG1173 View Post
    here is one of the things that is confusing me when trying to figure what to change. when working with the ve tables, SA, etc you can datalog and figure out where in the table you are pulling from, but when your working with the IAC you get counts in your logs. looking at the attachment does not really see like it works the same. Is there a way to make tunerpro log calculated airflow?
    IAC tables.jpg
    The ones pictured based on airflow and temp are probably more for warm up and driveability and the last I would mess with.I alway try to leave those be and only work on warmed up operating temps.

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
    -= =-

  7. #7
    Administrator
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Lakes Region, NH
    Age
    54
    Posts
    3,853
    Mark's right about leaving some tables alone. The ones pictured describe the relationship between the IAC valve shape and the TB. Work on other parameters first. A simple trick is to compare the auto trans tables with the manual trans tables and see where the differences show up (can TP do compares??).

  8. #8
    Fuel Injected! PJG1173's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Jacksonville NC
    Age
    50
    Posts
    641
    I was just using those as an example showing the air flow. The MPH for idle spark in my bin is 3mph. yes the purpose of the truck is mainly for off road so when I let off the throttle i need it to idle down not linger. there is a setting in the bin for it to calculate the gear reduction while in 4lo.
    87 4Runner, 15" spring lift, 3" body, chevy vortec 355, 5.29 gears, 38.5x15.5x15" Boggers, 280hr, 16168625 running $0D
    93 S10, 36x12.5x15 TSL's, custom turbo headers, 266HR cam, p&p vortec heads, $0D Marine MPFI with 8psi boost.
    05 Silverado, 2' lift, 4" exhaust, Bully Dog programmer,

  9. #9
    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    North Idaho
    Age
    63
    Posts
    10,477
    Quote Originally Posted by 1project2many View Post
    A simple trick is to compare the auto trans tables with the manual trans tables and see where the differences show up (can TP do compares??).
    Yup! It will give exact differnce of each paremeter opened. Or differance tool shows entire bin file.

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
    -= =-

  10. #10
    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    North Idaho
    Age
    63
    Posts
    10,477
    Quote Originally Posted by PJG1173 View Post
    I was just using those as an example showing the air flow. The MPH for idle spark in my bin is 3mph. yes the purpose of the truck is mainly for off road so when I let off the throttle i need it to idle down not linger. there is a setting in the bin for it to calculate the gear reduction while in 4lo.
    Well with that info and your issue I would try increasing MPH and removing the delay first! The 16297427 is very good a stable idle but has so much more capabilities built in mainly for emissions then compared to 1227747 ECM. On the 1227747 ECM I have worked on same issue for rock crawlers where it was not so much a difference in delay. But a rev up of engine! The cure there was to increase dead band of idle to avoid going into Stall Saver, which would increase idle when RPM went below RPM in dead band, invoking Stall Saver which would raise RPM by adding air through IAC.So worse in this case as idle was not delayed, but went down to idle but during rock crawling the lunge brought RPM below Idle Dead Band, then revved engine!

    It may take a couple of things to get the control you want, that snappy full control of throttle at low MPH, low RPM because of all the emmissions programmed into that area not needed or even noticed for the purpose they were built for, street driving. But usually one at a time and test, this case it may be 2! MPH of Idle spark and fuel tables, keeping it in idle tables and pretty sure that 3 second delay for Initail Idle decay to even start! Really sounds like an issue!

    But there's a lot of things that really work fine and should not be touched, don't go overboard and make a bunch of changes and say AHH! It's fixed! Only to find you caused a problem elsewhere...

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
    -= =-

  11. #11
    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    alabama
    Age
    41
    Posts
    1,705
    Quote Originally Posted by EagleMark View Post
    But there's a lot of things that really work fine and should not be touched, don't go overboard and make a bunch of changes and say AHH! It's fixed! Only to find you caused a problem elsewhere...
    Very good advise. Only change ONE thing at a time. When you change more than one at a time, and you have a negitave result, you dont know what one caused it. I found this the hard way and had to go back to a previously saved bin to fix the problem. And on that note, every time I make a change, I always save as new, that way I if it has bad results, I can just delete it and go back to before the change was made.

    I didnt have enough time this morning to fully read the IAC quote you posted mark, but I did this afternoon. Thats some super info. I think that sould be saved and posted somewhere on this site, as I have learned quite a few things from that about IAC logic I had no clue about.
    79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy

    93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver

    99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.

  12. #12
    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    North Idaho
    Age
    63
    Posts
    10,477
    I thought it was here but just looked and it is not? Found this one though written by same guy, RBob!
    http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...her-10-14-2000

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
    -= =-

  13. #13
    Vintage Methane Ejector
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    194
    Wow! Thats a good one!

  14. #14
    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    alabama
    Age
    41
    Posts
    1,705
    I would love to see some definations like those in XDF parameter comments! And the info in there thats in between the parameters, could you add a read me in between the diffrent parameters for that info?
    If all XDF's were set up like that, life would be great.
    79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy

    93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver

    99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.

  15. #15
    Fuel Injected! PJG1173's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Jacksonville NC
    Age
    50
    Posts
    641
    That would end up being a big xdf file when done.
    87 4Runner, 15" spring lift, 3" body, chevy vortec 355, 5.29 gears, 38.5x15.5x15" Boggers, 280hr, 16168625 running $0D
    93 S10, 36x12.5x15 TSL's, custom turbo headers, 266HR cam, p&p vortec heads, $0D Marine MPFI with 8psi boost.
    05 Silverado, 2' lift, 4" exhaust, Bully Dog programmer,

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •