$0D vs $E6 for 16168625 BBMC - 1993 K1500

[MAC]

Hello,

For the most part I am a total newbie and just getting started. Back in the early 2000's in successfully installed a Haltech E6K on a Turbo RX7 so I am not completely new to EFI tuning. That said, it has been 15 years and this is a lot different. I have TunerPro RT downloaded and setup, and I have downloaded a few bins and XDFs and done some exploring/familiarization but all just sitting in the recliner with the laptop.

My setup: Bone stock 1993 K1500 with 16128225 BBMC memcal. 5.7 TBI, 3.42 gears, 4L60E. AutoProm APU1 USB version from moates. Using TunerPro RT v5. I have installed the G1 header into the ECU and that is where I have stopped.

For now I just want to get a tune going that will run the stock truck reliably. My thinking is that this will allow me to get my feet wet and learn the basics before I start changing stuff. Then the fun starts :-)

The upgrade path, in this order, will be
Phase I: Wideband O2 sensor, new GMPP distributor, new fuel pump (AC Delco EP 381), new Aeromotive FPR

Phase II: New 4.56 gears (front and rear), new catback exhaust, I will change out the stock Y-collector, planing to keep stock exhaust manifolds for now (emissions)

Phase III: GMPP TBI to Vortec intake manifold w/ new Vortec heads, new camshaft (204/214 duration at .50 and .420/.433 lift with LSA at 112).

All of these goodies are sitting in my garage right now :-)

I have spent about 20 hours reading, searching, and planning everything out. I think I have reached the point of no return and now is the time to waive the flag and ask for help. Hopefully you guys will find me worthy and hopefully I have put in enough time to justify starting yet another newbie thread :-)

Despite all the reading, I can't seem to find much on my truck with the BBMC and I really don't understand all this yet. My head is really swimming with all this MEMCAL, BBC, Mask, BIN Definition files, and Datastream Definition files. I am learning though and hopefully it will sink in.


So here is the first question.

1) I need a BIN file to start with. What is your recommendation for BIN and then the associated XDF, and ADX?

http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...Information-E6 tells me to use $E6 but Dave at Moates recommends $0D. He says he always uses $0D for 4L60E trucks. I do not doubt his recommendation but I would like to understand why this forum says E6 and Dave says 0D.

Thanks Everyone, I am really looking forward to this journey.

AC

[jim_in_dorris]

There is nothing wrong with E6, but I would also recommend 0D as the mask to use. 0D is better documented and has more work done on the ADX and XDL files. This will make tuning much easier.

[MAC]

Thanks Jim. You pretty much confirmed what I expected. So you are confirming that I can run 0D on my 16168625 ECU? I read a post where EagleMark (I think it was him anyways) said this ECU is more-or-less identical to the 16197427 ECU.

So I think the next question is what BIN, XDF, and ADX files should I use?

Thoughts on 16197427 with:

A218 Trans2 $0D TP5 v250.adx
Advanced $0D TP5 v251.xdf

I found these here: http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...Information-0D. There are some other options listed but I don't know how to really decode these yet. I would assume that I would not want anything with TP4 since I am using TunerPro5.

By the way, how do these names breakdown? By that I mean what does A218 mean? What does Trans2 mean or Advanced mean? Is v250 version 250?

AC

[newellshk]

disclaimer - I'm pretty new to tuning myself but am a programmer and have spent a lot of time looking at the disassemblies/"hacks"

I have a 1993 s10 blazer with the cpi/vortec v6 which also runs the 16168625. I have tweaked my fuel/ve tables, spark advance, shift points, TCC lockup points, shift pressure/timing, line pressure and haven't run into any issues that would make me want to upgrade to OD. I might try it at some point anyway but there hasn't been any apparent problem that OD would solve.

I would suggest just start playing with the bin that's already running your truck. Any changes you make can easily be carried over to OD at a later time, so you aren't losing anything.

First step would be to read and save a copy of your stock bin(not really required if it's already on the net, but might as well do it anyway). From there you can begin exploring the calibration in TP, logging, and making changes.

Once you are more familiar then you will be in a better position to make comparisons when/if you do switch to OD, since you'll have to start with another bin. Granted since you can likely find a bin that ran on the same hardware and is running a newer OS and calibration it should theoretically be "better" to start with, but nobody is going to make any guarantees.

I am running E6_tpv5_v250.xdf and A201_E6_v250.adx from http://www.tunerpro.net/downloadBinDefs.htm, which are likely the same that you would find on this site. I haven't tried the transmission specific adx.

Once you have the xdf and your bin loaded, you can download other bins that run on the same OS just to make comparisons. You can also download the the OD xdf and bins and look through those to compare to your bin. You can only have one xdf open per tunerpro app, so you can't directly compare an E6 bin with a OD bin using TP's comparison tools, but opening two instances of the app you can easily compare things like timing tables visibly. You can also copy and paste from one to the other.

jim:

Do you have specific things in mind (or a link) regarding what's better with OD? I have looked through both disassemblies and they are both pretty complete (and share a lot of code). The E6 xdf has been excellent also imo.

[MAC]

Thanks Newellshk. I get what you are saying and it makes a lot of sense. Looking forward to hearing what Jim says in response. It probably doesn't matter, I don't think my planned mods are so wild or extreme that it would matter one way or the other. I think I will be able to make good power safely and efficiently with either E6 or 0D.

I have the Moates AutoProm APU1. This device apparently will not read the stock chip so I don't really have a way of getting the stock bin.

You mention OS - does this mean operating system? Is this how I should think of these? E6 is one operating system and 0D is a different one?

Are transmission specific adx files only for transmission information or are they fuel, ignition, and more detailed information on the transmission?

[jim_in_dorris]

Newell, don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with e6. I have about 300 hrs in my 0D source just commenting and formatting. I was also a programmer. 0D just has more work done on the xdf and ADX side
One thing I found looking at the hac disassembles is that not all the comments are necessarily correct. It takes a considerable amount of time to decipher what is actually going on in the code. I am aware of several tables in for instance $42 code where the comments are backwards in the hac disassembly. EagleMark and I had lots of discussions about what was correct. $0D and $E6 like many GM masks share a lot of commonality because they all function pretty much the same way. $0D just has more time put into it, hence the recommendation. The trans2 ADX is for transmission tuning, get the ADX without the word Trans in it.

[jim_in_dorris]

I have reached the point where I can take the hac code for $42 and $0D masks and create the source code for a particular BCC. It allows me to see what differences exist between BCCs. I really recommend using the latest BCC available for your particular vehicle.

[newellshk]

Agree with everything you said jim. I don't have 300 hours into it yet, but probably 100. I'm curious if you know of any significant inherent operational improvements between $OD and $E6.

MAC:

I believe you need the hdr1 memcal header to read your stock bin:
http://www.moates.net/hdr1-memcal-he....html?cPath=64

That's what i bought with my apu1 and g1.

Yes I meant operating system. $E6 and $OD each refer to a unique data layout(aka mask) of the calibration information within various bins. There can be a many different calibrations, your BBMC being one, that share a common data layout and therefore can all be edited in tuner pro with the same xdf, which defines (hence them being called a "definition") the data layout. I think that in most cases the machine code aka operating system is the same for bins that share a mask, but that's probably not always true since they may have tweaked the code year to year and continued to use the same data layout.