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Thread: Anyone worked with the 16196397 yet?

  1. #166
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    It's E-side processor...but it's pin 46 on the MCU, which is Port E bit 5, AN5, and as best we could tell it was unused, I thought? I don't even think the factory bins did anything with it at all? It's been a few months, I had to go back and pull the cover off the ECM to take another look. EDIT: It appears it was grounded in the OE configuration, which would tell me it's unused. I lifted the pin, used a 10K isolation resistor and a 470K pullup resistor, and tied it to pin C7, all completely off the board. I can use a different pin, but this one was the easiest one to lift and repurpose, so that's why I chose it.
    Last edited by Xnke; 11-25-2016 at 08:34 AM.

  2. #167
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    you'll need to reconfigure that pullup... I think, unless your wideband controller sinks current rather than sourcing. also, pin 46 is B4, an address pin...
    1995 Chevrolet Monte Carlo LS 3100 + 4T60E


  3. #168
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    I guess it would help if i went from memory instead of second guessing myself and looking at the 68HC11E1 pin diagram instead of thinking "Oh it was that pin on the corner of the chip, wasn't that pin 60? E1's don't have sixty pins in a PLCC". Anyway, I split the case and it's 68HC11F1, PLCC, Pin 60, AN4/PE4. I also checked and the pullup is actually a pulldown. Sorry bout the confusion.

  4. #169
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    took a look at my patch and I see why fueling issues occurred when the boost patch is applied but the 2/3BAR bit isn't selected... I failed to re-insert some instructions that I overwrote to go do the boost VE table lookup. I could fix it, but at this point, if the boost patch is applied, why someone would run a 1BAR MAP sensor, I don't know. sounds like you have the hardware good to go as-is unless you want to throw some kind of RC low-pass filter in there. i'll have to look around for a decent place to insert the WB A/D read, it will probably get put into one of the 80Hz loops, though anything 10Hz or faster is probably sufficient for just streaming the info back to tunerpro.
    1995 Chevrolet Monte Carlo LS 3100 + 4T60E


  5. #170
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    The update frequency being even 10hz won't matter, for some reason I can't get datarate higher than 9Hz anyway. It's *very* choppy sometimes, average datarate is 6hz but it'll run 10-11hz, then drop to 1.5 or 1.2hz and then jump back up. I've attached a short datalog that shows what I mean well. Once I get the datarate up to a steady value, the wideband fitted, and the VSS sensor reading correctly (it's currently unhooked, as the transmission has to come out to fix a leaking core plug) then it's time to just drive and tune-the blower belt alignment couldn't be better and it fires right off every time now.

  6. #171
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    There may be a few other errors/omisisons in there...I found 5 tables in the XDF on the T-side that are called "New Table" and have no description, not sure what they are. Highway fuel AFR table won't allow anything nonzero to be entered into the 100kpA value, which would be problematic, I think. I have NO idea what to set to enable manual transmission mode, not much seems to make sense. I am still getting a lot of errors over the auto trans not being hooked up, and there are a LOT of tables concerning how to handle being clutched or not. Gonna have to take some notes from each BIN and figure it out. Hoping to have a 5-7 hours today to actually work on the running engine, we'll see what happens.

  7. #172
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    Got the engine ready for the rigors of tuning and idle control. Still need to get the exhaust finished and re-route the battery cable, I think where it is now it will get too hot and the insulation may melt in a bad way. I'll re-route it down lower and away from the header, as well as sleeve it with some thermal insulation. Coolant leaks are still present, which means I'll be dropping the transmission and replacing the freeze plug in the rear of the block on the left side, irritating but not too bad, all things considered. Must have goofed the install or something. Engine took 20 minutes to build coolant temperature, but the temperature never leveled off...a quick climb to 190F, then a slow, steady creep to 203-204F, I suspect the coolant leaks not allowing the radiator to build pressure do not help much with this. One bigger issue I think is that the two O2 sensors tend to split up and head opposite directions, the right bank O2 is generally pretty happy at 127-133 INT, however the left bank O2 rapidly pegs itself at 240 and stays there. Both sensors swing the INT around under various engine loading conditions, so I suspect both are working fine-but maybe I have them swapped left-sensor-in-right-pipe and vice-versa? Would that tend to cause the O2 sensor results to split and go opposite directions, ultimately ending up with one "good" number and one "way off" number?

  8. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xnke View Post
    I suspect both are working fine-but maybe I have them swapped left-sensor-in-right-pipe and vice-versa? Would that tend to cause the O2 sensor results to split and go opposite directions, ultimately ending up with one "good" number and one "way off" number?
    Easy way to check is just unplug one, that's how I cheat finding bank 1 or bank 2 from manufacture to manufacture.
    89 K1500 Scottsdale 5.7L 5spd 3:42 RamJet cam Dart iron TBI heads 427 PCM swap
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    05 Outback XT 2.5L turbo gas auto

  9. #174
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    Ok, so I had the injector size setup as 17.50Lbs/hr and the truck would run well enough at 1600-3000RPM. Well enough to actually think about tuning it...I did nothing but multiply the 3.1L V6 map by 1.1 to adjust it for the 3.4L engine.

    There are 36lb/hr injectors installed. When I changed the bin to reflect this, the truck will fire, but struggles to attempt to run and dies out. Pumping the throttle is the only way to keep it going, but I'm just bouncing it along with the accel enrichment.

    I ASSUME that changing the injector size but not the VE table means the computer has pulled pulsewidth WAY down-this would make sense if the VE table is actually a VE table. Lots of tuning stuff says it's VE, but it isn't really. I have a few datalogs of the running BIN file with the wrong injector size, but the injector duty cycles are correct. Is there a way to work backwards from the known good injector duty cycle to adjust the tables?

    To compensate for the injector size being correct now, the VE table needs the values pushed up by the same percentage, or is there another table/scalar that needs to be adjusted?

    Tunerpro displays the MAP value at exactly half of the real value-Not sure how to edit the ADX to fix this? Or is the ECM only partially fooled by the 2-bar MAP support? Seems like there is still a lot of configuration that I need to work out in the BIN file...
    Last edited by Xnke; 11-29-2016 at 05:13 AM. Reason: Fix the silly formatting issues

  10. #175
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    Just did a compare BIN against the F-body manual configuration, and made all(?) the appropriate changes...hopefully that helps some. It did take care of a few errors that were present, but mostly just cleanup stuff.

    Gotta wait till 8AM to start the truck again.

  11. #176
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    i'll try to get to as many of these as i can before work: I loaded up the log, you have something causing stream corruption. which ADX file are you using and what kind of interface for that matter?

    the rest of your ALDL issues are kind of my fault..... i didn't create/release the modified ADX required for use with the 2/3BAR code. i placed the raw 2/3BAR MAP sensor raw a/d value into the T-side over SPI by repurposing the E-side calibration module part number, but never changed the ADX to read the new value. so, what you're seeing is the emulated 1BAR signal that is passed to the T-side, why it's only half scale, i'll have to investigate. if it's only showing up as half-scale on the T-side, it's going to be showing up that way on the e-side as well.

    i would recommend not running the engine(or at least driving) at this point, you're probably getting way too much advance delivered and not nearly enough fuel either. this may be why you're having to signficantly play around with fuel delivery. and why you roughly doubled injector size and didn't have to change the injector size to get correct fueling. if you have really conservative spark settings, it may not be an issue, but it isn't correct either. i'll get back on this and run a few simulations when I get home. looks like I goofed the math somewhere and did an extra divide.

    the 5 tables on the T-side with no labeling is odd, even with tables that i have no clue what their function is, i at least label them with their location.

    not sure what you're seeing with the highway fuel table, I'm able to change the value anywhere in the 0-25.5 range?

    manual trans stuff, there are a few items here that need addressed, as long as the couple bits and scalars are played with, it should do okay there.

    the O2 sensors are acting like a FWD application(only right/rear is active), there are a few more bits that control that, it looks like even with an O2 sensor connected(try swapping connectors/circuits to see if it still happens?) to the front/left circuit, the left/front trim goes nuts(though with a FWD application, that trim is ignored).

    the VE table is a VE table, but I can't make any scale work for it that makes sense. GM's choice to make it a 16-bit table and then still only use less than 2% of the table's possible resolution is baffling.
    Last edited by RobertISaar; 11-29-2016 at 09:20 PM.
    1995 Chevrolet Monte Carlo LS 3100 + 4T60E


  12. #177
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    No problem. I've got another (longer) log that has NO stream corruption...until I shut the engine off mid-log and restart it. Then the corruption comes back.

    I tried some stream corruption advice from the tunerpro/moates websites and none of it helped, so I put it back exactly the way it was. Now it connects but still usually has the corruption problems. Rarely (1 connection in 12) I'll get a corruption free connection.

    The connection hardware is an FTDI (real FTDI) USB to pigtail interface, tied to a chinabay ALDL connector. I followed the construction article here on GearheadEFI. It's connected to 12-15 F-body and L-body ECU's via my bench flash harness. I have "A few" ecu's spare incase I break or brick one...Plus I've used Scan94/95 on several V6 Fbody's for friends. With Scan94/95 and Winflash I've had no issues with connection problems so far.

    Here's the BIN, ADX, and XDF I'm using.

  13. #178
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    The highway fuel table is all fine-except the 100kpA row...it's locked at 0 for me. All the other rows work.

    I've got to get the clutch switch fitted to my clutch pedal and figure out if it's active-high or active low, but I can't even find a flag/scalar/table that mentions it's use, only methods that don't require the switch such as RPM/load/MPH. Maybe it's one of the unmarked ones, I should be able to work it out.

    In the meantime instead of tuning today, I started reassembling the dash and worked on getting some body panels aligned better, and took some measurements for the exhaust work. I'd like to get a muffler on it prior to boosting things...just been running with the boost bypass wide open.

    Hopefully the potentially excessive spark advance (it's not too bad, really) didn't pop a headgasket and cause the water leak. Although that is the easier fix, I guess...change a headgasket or replace the freeze plug behind the flywheel while it's in the truck...either is great fun.

  14. #179
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    Still working on learning tunerpro. Lots of stuff I can't find documentation I feel like I am missing.

    In other news, the exhaust fitting is going well and the wideband sensor will be right to the back of the cab, so easy to fit and unfit when needed.

  15. #180
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    Any luck working out the MAP sensor issues? I'm itchin' to drive my truck home, it'd be much easier to work on at the home shop instead of the combustion laboratory.

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