Open Throttle VE vs MAP vs RPM is for adjusting ~ Off Idle
Idle VE vs MAP vs RPM is for adjusting ~ Near Idle
It's a good plan to use closed loop data.
dave w
Open Throttle VE vs MAP vs RPM is for adjusting ~ Off Idle
Idle VE vs MAP vs RPM is for adjusting ~ Near Idle
It's a good plan to use closed loop data.
dave w
Have you adjusted the injector offset Vs battery voltage? Since you have installed MPFI injectors, this needs to be changed to match the new injectors as it can have a big effect on how it runs. Are you using junkyard injectors or ones from a aftermarket company?
79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy
93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver
99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.
How is the idle quality with your setup ? I wasn't able to stabilize the idle and have it be respectable with my 502 setup until I went to PFI mode with the '7427. You didn't mention camshaft so that might be a difference.
Your setup is very similar to mine before I went with the 502 , my original 454 was also bored and stroked to 489 , although it wore first a set of Vortec heads then a set of AFR heads and a few different cams .
TOM
1994 3500 Dually , 502 (509) , 264HR , Edelbrock MPFI , PFI '7427
1992 S-10 434 SBC/Tremec - '7427
1986 Monte Carlo SS
1984 S-10 , SAS, 496/700R4/205 , D44/14BFF -'7427
1980 Z-28 496/700R4
1979 Corvette 496/700R4
1977 Olds 98 Regency 403/700R4
I didnt even think about that. You did do all the required mods to run MPFI right?Originally Posted by Nasty-Z
79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy
93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver
99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.
As I explained to TOM, the Edelbrock conversion was done some 8 years ago. Unaware of all this stuff when it was done. Worked fairly well. Used Moates APU1 to make changes about which I knew absolutely NOTHING! Still it worked out after capturing the Edelbrock binary supplied on their chip. Also purchased another programmed chip from which to extract data, although I had little idea about what I was doing. Still puzzled as to what the ECU mods really do. Still have not done them and yet the stock, with exception of the flash chip, ECU and Engine run just fine.
Gentlemen: Just to provide some background about myself, I really like working on Internal Combustion Engines especially the Small Block Chevrolet. It is a compact package capable of much horsepower depending on how much a person spends on building up one. I was in Aviation Electronics, known as Avionics, for 38+ years. Electronics is nothing new to me. Yet, getting through TunerPro RT V5.x is somewhat of a challenge. Have read many of the posts here on gearhead-efi. Am very greatfull for this Internet Site as it has been a wealth of knowledge. Many of you fellows have extensive knowledge just through exposure doing your own GM EFI projects. A special thanks to Dave W. as he had been VERY helpful. I have two chevrolet trucks that I work on. One a 1994 BBC Suburban and the other a 1995 Chevrolet C1500 2WD pickup that is in good condition except it leaks and uses engine oil. Am preparing a 350 Vortec and will be using a BBC TBI throttle body on top of a 4 barrel manifold with adapter. Just added a LT-4 Hot Cam to the Vortec and today the stronger Crane Cams valve springs came via UPS. Need to install these and mock up and set the fuel pressure regulator on the BBC throttle body. Then run the Vortec on my home brew run-in stand with a Holley 4 barrel carb. Also have a harness for the 16197427 ECU. Shall see if I can get the harness and BBC throttle body all mocked up on the run-in stand which provides NO dynamic load whatsoever to the Vortec. At least I can check for oil leaks etc. before installing same in the '95 pickup.
It is nice to have you fellow to consult with.
Regards,
Rolly
Tucson, Arizona
if you have a multiport intake and injectors I have no idea why you would want to run them in a tbi fueling mode. ya it'll run but leaves a lot on the table no?
Tom:
No problems with idle quality after installing Edelbrock TBI to batch injected MPFI via the 16197427 ECU. Did not know about the injector offset vs battery voltage. The conversion was done some 8 years ago. Purchased Craig Moates AutoProm APU1 which was of the initial production run. Talked to Craig and received some advice from him. Unaware about modifying the ECU and Edelbrock said nothing about it. Just did the conversion and it worked out. The Edelbrock kit (chose 502 cu in kit w/29 Lb/Hr injectors) came with new Intake Manifold, new Magnetti Marelli Pico Injectors, new fuel pump, and new programmed memory chip for ECU and other small hardware.
TOM: Do you have a binary file for 489 or 502 big block that works in a 16197427 ECU? Did you do the upgrades to Edelbrock TBI to MPFI injection? Please advise. Thanks.
Rolly
Rolly... You're over thinking this!Don't understand the PDF file with the table labeled with Constants.
There are three types of parameters; Constants, Flags and Tables.A scalar, by any other name, still does the same job.TunerPro has Scalars, Flags and Tables.
Understand. The description in the LH column is different than what is presented in TunerPro for the four letter code in the 16197427 ECU. It is really difficult to get the confidence that performing the change in the binary will yield the appropriate binary for the MPFI (batch fire mode) in the 489 Big Block. There must be significant variable(s) for selecting going from TBI to MPFI. Have not yet seen these significant variables. There is one variable that describes CID for one cylinder. When multiplying by 8 cylinders, the total displacement does not work out. Hard to build confidence.
I think the Edelbrock binary (.bin) file is not for the 16197427 computer, it's only 32K in size? The 16197427 .bin file is 64K in size. Can you post the definition file (.xdf) you are using with the Edelbrock .bin file?
The MPFI conversion is not easy for a beginner. Generally, the MPFI conversion is not the first ever experience someone starts off with. Generally, a beginner will start off with a completely stock or nearly stock engine with a completely stock binary (.bin) to learn TunerPro and learn the parameters of the .bin file. The learning curve you have set out for yourself, by choosing to do a MPFI conversion as your first .bin has put you on an extremely steep or nearly vertical uphill learning curve.
Myself and other members here at gearhead-efi.com can provide compen$ated help if you would like to go that route? Maybe it would be a good plan for you to get the help of a "hired gun" to get you up to speed and help you build confidence?
dave w
Dave:
Thanks again for the assistance. Don't understand the statement "It's a good plan to use closed loop data". Please expand on the statement please. Thanks.
Closed loop is when the computer takes full control of both fuel and spark based on the information from the sensors (Knock, TPS, O2, MAP, RPM, & CTS). Tune using only the data that was recorded when the computer was in closed loop.
dave w
Dave: Did exactly that with a BJKW 0E altered binary and the Suburban is running fairly well. In the process of using your spreadsheet and BLM data to correct the BJKW binary. Looks to be a VERY good method/process. Again, thanks for all your assistance.
Regards,
Rolly
Tucson, Arizona
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