1227747 to 16197427 Conversion Box!

[Six_Shooter]

Some datalogging cables and cables for proper scanners do have the pins for M and E jumpered together.

[d0nk3y]

Update.
I don't have a datalog to post, but something just isn't right with what I've done. This is what I have:

16197427 controller, BJXL ($0D)
necessary $0D bins, definitions, acquisition files
Moates APU1 setup & TunerPro RT
My home-made translation harness (Vehicle is wired for 7747 controller)

Can tune and acquire data using a modified 7747 controller, just too darned slow of a data rate to look at any transient conditions.

Hooking up my translation harness (which I've now pinned out and rechecked for shorts/wrong connections twice) with the emulator loaded with $0D files makes it run in limp mode - or so I think. I can't tell for certain, because the signals that come across are "wrong" or missing, for example:
ECT = -38
RPM always = 0
- but things like O2 voltage and TPS voltage seemed correct and tracking. Last night I was trying several different definitions and acquisition files and ended up getting a datastream that has every single channel recorded dithering between different values at a very rapid rate. Forgot to bring the save or post it up last night - actually, I was pretty durned whizzed off and needed a break.

The only thing I have not verified is the memcal "thing" is free from shorts or opens. I desoldered the chip and soldered in a tall "stand-off" socket to plug the emulator into - maybe I borked something there. I also have the red wire in the ribbon (representing the notch in the chip) on the "outside" - directly opposite of how the 7747 wants to be.


So, is there anything this total n00b is overlooking? This is getting to be too much like work!

[dave w]

You have many variables to confirm. I would build / troubleshoot off of know working systems. For example, does everything work for the '7747? Ok, if everything is working for the '7747, try using just the '427, (no emulation). If just using the '427 is good, add emulation as a variable. Yes, this stuff is work!

dave w

[EagleMark]

example:
ECT = -38

You meen CTS? -38 is very close to -40 which is a bad CTS. If that temp is correct choke is added like crazy. Here's a link to test.
http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...erature+Sensor

I also have the red wire in the ribbon (representing the notch in the chip) on the "outside" - directly opposite of how the 7747 wants to be.

Yup! 1227747 notch inside. 16197427 notch outside. I have adapters from Moates for all testing and tuning, only use a soldered in chip in the Memcal when I burn a final chip. But with their hearder you can plug it into AutoProm and erase and burn.

[d0nk3y]

The CTS (sorry, we use "ECT @ work :D ) is functioning correctly when the 7747 is plugged in and logging. What adapter is the correct one from moates? I couldn't tell from his documentation on the page.

[EagleMark]

Adapter so you can use 27FS512 chip and still plug in your Memcal:
http://www.moates.net/g1-memory-adap....html?cPath=64

27SF512 chip:
http://www.moates.net/c2-sst-27sf512....html?cPath=26

And the header so you can read the chip in the Memcal:
http://www.moates.net/hdr1-memcal-he....html?cPath=64

Then when you solder in a 27FS512 chip or socket to Memcal use the header to erase and burn new chip in Memcal.
http://www.moates.net/d2-28pin-dip-s....html?cPath=26

I found it easier to solder in a chip, then a socket. Dave W did some write ups on other cheaper options.

[FSJ Guy]

That G1 adapter is really slick.

I bought the switching adapter since I had the bin switcher for my '7747 ECM. But then I found out that the AutoProm will not program the larger chip needed for the switcher. I need to buy the Burn2 in order to program the larger EEPROM. Eventually, I'll buy the Burn2 so I can finally use the bin switcher so I can have a "valet" mode with limited speed and rpm. :D

[d0nk3y]

Thanks Mark!
It still took me some time to look at the pictures on the site and doing a google image search, plus your instructions, to finally get it through my thick skull!

[d0nk3y]

That G1 adapter is really slick.

I bought the switching adapter since I had the bin switcher for my '7747 ECM. But then I found out that the AutoProm will not program the larger chip needed for the switcher. I need to buy the Burn2 in order to program the larger EEPROM. Eventually, I'll buy the Burn2 so I can finally use the bin switcher so I can have a "valet" mode with limited speed and rpm. :D

Dang - I didn't realize the autoprom doesn't burn AM29F040 chips. :(

[EagleMark]

Dang - I didn't realize the autoprom doesn't burn AM29F040 chips. :(

I just opened my AutoProm and it has the 29F040 chip listed as burnable... not read only. But the information at Moates on AutoProm does not have it listed as burnable? I thought the AutoPro burn side was a Burn2 inside? I've never used one of those 29F040 chips, looked at Moates and it is huge!

AM29F040B-90PC This monster can handle your multi-program binaries. Goes great
with the G3 adapter. 4 megabit chip, can hold 16x 32k (730-type) or 8x 64k (95
TBI, etc) programs

and it's got 32 pins... I think that is what some of the diesel stuff uses...

So how many bins would a 27SF512 hold? Pensonally I like to tune one for everything.... but could see a use for 2 on a race car!

[FSJ Guy]

Yes, it shows the 29F040 chip in the window, but for some reason it will not work with the AutoProm. It's right there on the website, but I never paid attention since when I bought it I was using the '7747 box and only needed the 27SF512 chip. When I ordered the G3 adapter, I didn't even think to look and make sure the AutoProm would work. Oh well. I can emulate if I really needed to. I haven't tried emulating a 29F040 size chip, however.

The 29SF512 is a 64 KB chip AFAIK. So you only get one 7427 sized bin.

[d0nk3y]

Well,
I had limited success today and I'm really confused now.

Got the 16197427 to work today...sorta. When emulating, the data acquisition (and the controller) only seemed to work if the BIN upload to the emulator failed. (???) I finally got all the signals to come across and actually started to change calibrations, but it was short lived. Kept getting resets or something after awhile - could see O2 signal dropping out and spark advance jumping up periodically. After the engine stalled, you could hear the fuel pump relay energize with the resetting.

I grabbed another controller and swapped memcals - same dang behavior. Does anybody else have flaky behavior when emulating? Pinned out my modded memcal to check for opens & shorts - seemed okay. A buddy may swing by tomorrow with a G1 and an oscilloscope and lend a hand.

[JeepsAndGuns]

Well, now that you mention it, I had a couple quirks too. Last weekend I made up a couple bins to try out. I started out with BMHK, witch is a 454 $0E manual trans bin. I have been doing all my tuning from that bin. I figured, just for the hell of it, I would try a 350 auto $0D bin, and then I also had a 350 auto $31 bin. Wanted to try them just to see how diffrently they ran.
I did all the exact same prep work/adjustments to them as I did to my $0E bin, and inputted my fuel and timing tables. I loaded one on the emulator and it wouldt work. Tried the other one and it wouldnt work either. It uploaded, I enabled emulation, but I couldnt get aldl connection and it was just running off the limp home chips. I could burn them to a chip and they would work, but I couldnt emulate with them. I checked all my cable connections and all was good. After trying them out on chips (an not likeing them) I decided to try emulation with my $0E bin, and it worked just fine. I tried the $0D bin again and it still wouldnt work. I uploaded it to the emulator, then hit verify emulator contents aganst loaded bin, and I got failure.
Both of the bins I tried ($0D, and $31) that didnt work were bins I read from memcals. The BMHK $0E bin I am using (that works) was downloaded from this site.

[d0nk3y]

well, well, well.

I'll have to give that a look-see in the morning! Thank you for sharing!!!

[EagleMark]

I've had those problems before and it would say emulating but was not... As soon as that happens to me I shut down TunerPro, open it and it finds the AutoProm. If it does not find AutoProm when I start it, because I have it set in preferences that way, Then I always turn computer off, plug in AutoProm, restart computer, then open TP and it always works first time.

You have to save bin after changes. IIRC both switches on AutoProm are in, together. Then upload to emulater. Then of course enable emulation... then turn key on and CEL should flash once and stay on till car is started then turn off.

Some times when I open TP it does not find my AutoProm. I close TP move USB to another port, open TP till it finds it. I have 3 USB ports and for some reason they change USB COM3 to another when I use my USB mouse, my USB printer or my USB camera.