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Thread: WBO2 options

  1. #1
    Electronic Ignition!
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    WBO2 options

    Since I'm getting close to having enough money saved up to buy EFILive, I was looking into WBO2 options. I started on their website and after browsing the ones they list, I'm not sure what I'm looking at. I looked at the .pdf that's included in the software and I'm a little confused.

    On the .pdf, it says that there will be a NBO2 output that needs to be wired to the ECM and you can put the WBO2 into the bung for the original sensor. Well, nothing on the manufactures websites say anything about having a NBO2 output. So is the a universal feature of WBO2 controllers or am I missing some jargon I do not know yet.

    Also, EFILive says the V2 takes a serial input or an analog input from the WBO2. From what I've read, using serial seems to be more accurate so I'd like to just get that first.

    Any help on what I'm looking at/for and suggestions on what you've used and works well would be appreciated.

    Also, are there some newb help topics I'm missing on the forum that will give me some insight on what I'm looking for in starting this?

  2. #2
    Super Moderator dave w's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TerryD View Post
    Since I'm getting close to having enough money saved up to buy EFILive, I was looking into WBO2 options. I started on their website and after browsing the ones they list, I'm not sure what I'm looking at. I looked at the .pdf that's included in the software and I'm a little confused.

    On the .pdf, it says that there will be a NBO2 output that needs to be wired to the ECM and you can put the WBO2 into the bung for the original sensor. Well, nothing on the manufactures websites say anything about having a NBO2 output. So is the a universal feature of WBO2 controllers or am I missing some jargon I do not know yet.

    Also, EFILive says the V2 takes a serial input or an analog input from the WBO2. From what I've read, using serial seems to be more accurate so I'd like to just get that first.

    Any help on what I'm looking at/for and suggestions on what you've used and works well would be appreciated.

    Also, are there some newb help topics I'm missing on the forum that will give me some insight on what I'm looking for in starting this?
    Some WBO2 manufactures offer two outputs from the WBO2, one wide band and one simulated narrow band. I use the Innovate MTX-L http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/MTXL.php The MTX-L outputs a 0 VDC ~ 5 VDC WBO2 signal and a 0.1 VDC ~ 1.1 VDC Narrow Band signal. The MTX-L factory default setting has 0 VDC = AFR 7.35:1 and 5 VDC = AFR 22.39:1. The MTX-L simulated narrow band factory default setting has 1.1 VDC = AFR 14:1 and 0.1 VDC = AFR 15:1. The MTX-L could be used as described by EFI Live, the MTX-L WBO2 output could be wired to the V2, and Narrow Band output from the MTX-L could be wired to the ECM / PCM.

    I have not connected my MTX-L to my EFI Live V2, so I don't have useful information to share on that topic.

    dave w
    Last edited by dave w; 05-29-2014 at 10:43 PM.

  3. #3
    Fuel Injected!
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    Beyond what Dave posted, if you have an extra bung in the exhaust then you don't need to do anything with the narrowband O2 sensors at all. Just install the WBO2 to log and remove it when done. From what I understand, you want the wideband upstream of the narrowbands because each O2 sensor slightly modifies the AFR.

    If you do want one to simulate/replace the narrowband then just look for a wideband with dual programmable analog outputs so one can be programmed to simulate a narrowband. FYI, I have read that this doesn't work as well as a real narrowband, likely because the narrowband isn't a linear curve and the wideband is a linear curve. I have never bothered trying it, I just run another O2 bung.

  4. #4
    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lionelhutz View Post
    FYI, I have read that this doesn't work as well as a real narrowband, likely because the narrowband isn't a linear curve and the wideband is a linear curve. I have never bothered trying it, I just run another O2 bung.
    I have the MTX-L in my jeep. I tried for a while, running my pcm with the simulated narrow band output. It would work fine for a few days then I would get a o2 sensor code pop up. I would have to reset the pcm to clear the code and then be fine for a few more days. I eventually went back to a regular heated narrow band.
    It could have been the voltage range the MTX-L was putting out was not exactly what my pcm was looking for, but I could not find the exact range I needed it to put out and at what afr to program it. So I just switched back to the NB.
    My system is a OBD1, 16197427 system, so I am not sure if obd2 would be different.
    79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy

    93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver

    99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.

  5. #5
    Electronic Ignition!
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    Thanks for the info guys. I'll look into that innovative unit! I'm not sure I want to put another bung in but I'll consider that as well.

  6. #6
    EFI GearHead ! EagleMark's Avatar
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    I always go with another bung. They come with a plug so when done just plug it up. I've tried several times to use the simulated narrow band and all it does is waste my time, yeah it can simulate but it can't do cross counts so that is why the CEL code comes on when the test is run.

    Also when you get the WB and hook it to the EFI Live V2 get a Null Modem. With the Null Modem you can disconnect from your V2 and hook up to the Innovate WB controller to configure both the channels and update firmware if need be and do the free air calibration. Believe me it is the way to go over the TAQ cable which always seems to be to short and also seems to have a slightly larger end so it needs to be forced in. It's OK but when you go back to the regular cables now your socket is loose?

    The serial hook up to V2 is the most accurate way to get your WB readings into EFI Live. Way better then the AD ports.

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
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  7. #7
    Electronic Ignition!
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    Thanks guys. Mark, is that a cable you have to buy extra or an option you select?

  8. #8
    EFI GearHead ! EagleMark's Avatar
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    My Innovate LC1 came with the cable and all I needed was a Null Modem adapter to hook it up to cable that comes with EFI Live V2. Not sure about the MTX-l ?

    This way it's easy to hook up to the V2 and then change to hook up to laptop for programming. There a few threads on it at EFI Live site.

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
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  9. #9
    Electronic Ignition!
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    Thanks! Just looked and I liked the look of the lc-2 they make. Price seems reasonable and I think it would be easier to have it mobile with that setup. The gauge one might be an option when I set up the Monte Carlo and would want an extra eye on things with the turbo.

  10. #10
    EFI GearHead ! EagleMark's Avatar
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    The LC-2 is the way to go for temporary mounting. Way to easy. The tailpipe extension is another time saver but seems to be only very accurate at WOT runs. Can get some air during cruise situations. That is what it is designed for on a dyno. So if you can do all your tuning via NB and only need the WB for the WOT then it's perfect. But still the exhaust shop only charges me $35 to install a separate bung when I need them. I have an LC-1 mounted in my truck and really no need for it anymore and it's a lot of work to remove and re-install.

    I'd like to sell/trade my LC-1 for a LC-2...

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
    -= =-

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