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Thread: TBI Chip data check?

  1. #1
    Electronic Ignition! gearhead1's Avatar
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    See Below...
    Last edited by gearhead1; 02-24-2014 at 04:33 PM.

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    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
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    I moved your post to this forum.

    Looks like the fueling is close while driving... except for Idle and decel which is pig rich, typical for a aftermarket cam. No error codes set. Can you burn chips? If so add the Spark Advance and BPW hacks to the next bin so we can see that data as well.

    IAC counts were a little high from the limited Idle data, I'd turn the throttle blade screw in 1/2 turn to let more air over throttle blades to mix with fuel. This will give less air through the IAC but still leave you with idle control from ECM.

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
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    Electronic Ignition! gearhead1's Avatar
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    I deleted and put in different thread already but you were too quick sorry 'bout that.
    here it is -
    Eaglemark -just new at this can you tell me what you think of these short jaunts made in my truck it was about 36 degrees outside.
    1 ton 1978' 350 40"over edelbrock performer intake(no EGR) split duration cam 427/454 lift factory cast iron heads and manifolds true duels with no cats nv4500 5 speed manual np203 doubler np 205 to 4.56 axles 13psi pressure 1227747 with a custom chip.All TBI from 91'
    Any information or knowledable tips will be greatly appreciated kind sir.
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    Last edited by gearhead1; 02-24-2014 at 04:22 AM.

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    Electronic Ignition! gearhead1's Avatar
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    Eaglemark- Should I turn the throttle blade screw in as it sits or ...
    jump A-B unplug IAC when bottomed ,start,adjust screw,shut off, then adjust TPS to original setting like I was adjusting minimum air flow(idle)?
    Thanks again.

  5. #5
    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
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    Just turn it in. Your TPS voltage was a little low so it will be fine.

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
    -= =-

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    Electronic Ignition! gearhead1's Avatar
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    EagleMark- I cannot burn chips as of now as I am on the fence as to which to invest in ; a burn2,ostrich2.0 or a AutoProm ? I am currently running 3 vehicles with OBD1 and it seems like a no brainer but; As i read more and more threads on here, trying to follow all this my brain turns to mush.

  7. #7
    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
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    AutoProm!

    Tuning is not for everyone, takes a commitment of time and money to catch up.

    If you have three OBDI vehicles you at least need a cable to read codes and data which you have. It's a must have tool for fixing them.

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
    -= =-

  8. #8
    Fuel Injected!
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    Quote Originally Posted by gearhead1 View Post
    EagleMark- I cannot burn chips as of now as I am on the fence as to which to invest in ; a burn2,ostrich2.0 or a AutoProm ? I am currently running 3 vehicles with OBD1 and it seems like a no brainer but; As i read more and more threads on here, trying to follow all this my brain turns to mush.
    Don't feel alone.

    I can't seem to figure out what I am trying to accomplish some days.

  9. #9
    Electronic Ignition! gearhead1's Avatar
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    Throttle adjustment

    Here is a couple before and after with a little longer idle periods I wanted to see the differences from just doing as EagleMark suggested and turning the throttle screw in half turn and see what effect that had.
    I'm learning forgive my Baby Steps...
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    Last edited by gearhead1; 02-26-2014 at 04:36 PM.

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    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gearhead1 View Post
    Eaglemark- Should I turn the throttle blade screw in as it sits or ...
    jump A-B unplug IAC when bottomed ,start,adjust screw,shut off, then adjust TPS to original setting like I was adjusting minimum air flow(idle)?
    Thanks again.
    That is the factory procedure and works OK when starting with a new, rebuilt TBI or... get's you in ballpark.

    The way I fine tune this is way easier. But it has to be done fully warmed up and driven so oil is hot, intake warmed etc... so end of a log. Like you just did. The purpose for this and reason it is so important on TBI engines is the injector is above the throttle plates! So you want as much air as possible to mix with fuel coming into intake manifold! Makes for good idle stability and fueling tuning!

    I looked at your after and at first the IAC counts at idle were perfect, under 15. But after your drive shows the engine may have not been fully warmed so end of log IAC counts were to low = 0. This may be do to winter driving conditions and temps. So we over shot. Turn screw out 1/4 turn and your done. Never have to adjust again. As it is right now it's probably a borderline 0 but you want to leave a lttle IAC counts showing so ECM has some control over idle. Problem leaving it at this borderline is the idle RPM can vary and some days you may get what the chip is set for... like 650 RPM and some days maybe 750 RPM...

    Your first highway speed cruise in After log shows Open Loop the entire time until 3.00 in log? Engine was plenty warmed up at starting temp of 205 and cooled to 190*ish so it was not cold or warming up? Then it finally went Closed Loop? Went OL again if it get's near idle? Could be an Open Loop Idle bin/Chip but there's nothing in your motor build that needs it and something wrong that it stays OL when warmed up at highway speed?

    Fueling looks to be very good. No knock counts at all. So you have some room for more spark advance as long as the knock sensor is working properly and whoever did your Custom Chip did not disable the knock sensor?

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
    -= =-

  11. #11
    Super Moderator Six_Shooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gearhead1 View Post
    EagleMark- I cannot burn chips as of now as I am on the fence as to which to invest in ; a burn2,ostrich2.0 or a AutoProm ? I am currently running 3 vehicles with OBD1 and it seems like a no brainer but; As i read more and more threads on here, trying to follow all this my brain turns to mush.
    If you don't care about real time emulation, then the BURN2 would be the way to go.

    If you want real time emulation, and may want to leave the emulator in the vehicle, even if occasionally, the Ostrich 2.0 would be the way to go, along with the BURN2

    If you want real time emulation, datalogging and ability to program EEPROMs through a single (USB) connection, AutoProm is the way to go.

    I own 3 Ostrich 2.0s, one I leave in my car, as a permanent EEPROM replacement, one I use for tuning other people's vehicles and the third was a good deal and I use it on my test bench, as a back up and if I get lazy and don't want to connect my laptop to my Ostrich in my car, I will flash it from my PC and then swap it out in my car. I also own an AutoProm, and it's great, for most applications, however there are some codes that the AutoProm doesn't play well with. $58 (Stock Sy/Ty/Turbo Sunbird/Turbo Grand Am) does not like the AutoProm communications packet switching, there is a work around but I have still experienced some issues with it, so I use my Ostrich and ALDL Xtreme when I use that code. I believe another one that is an issue is $31T (Turbo 3.8L SFI) but I have not verified this one personally. I have not heard of issues with any other code that I can recall. These issues appear to be in emulation or "AutoProm Mode" of the AutoProm, "pass through mode" where only ALDL comms are being connected to it is not an issue.

    I also own other Moates products but they are not GM specific.

    Another thing to consider is that since you have an ALDL cable already, and if you're on a budget, you can add functionality as you can afford it. You can by the BURN2 and be able to program EEPROMs for all 3 of your vehicles, or you can buy the Ostrich and be able to real time tune one of them. Then once a few more dollars are freed up buy the BURN2 to program EEPROMs and you will have a full tuning suite of hardware, real time tuning and programming EEPROMs.
    Last edited by Six_Shooter; 02-28-2014 at 02:50 AM.
    The man who says something is impossible, is usually interrupted by the man doing it.

  12. #12
    Electronic Ignition! gearhead1's Avatar
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    Thank you guys for the replies -I saw my OL mode was longer then normal but I did turn around and drove straight into the north wind and it was about -10(22)that day and thought maybe the cold was cooling the exhaust manifold You can see my O2 sensor reading went low for a period .I will keep watching and maybe for my application and weather I should swap for a heated 1. I did notice my OL idle since I have started this.
    My chip was done by Brian Harris- I bought one before for my s104x4v8 and always ran perfect as has this truck ; no complaints at all I just wanted to start tweaking on my own.The only thing I told him was to disable the EGR cause my carb manifold has no provision for it , I am running all other sensors including a 350 spec. knock sensor and knock module.
    Last edited by gearhead1; 02-27-2014 at 06:16 PM.

  13. #13
    Electronic Ignition! gearhead1's Avatar
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    Six_Shooter- You talked me into it...Just ordered the burn2

    You guys have any tips for this burner?

    Thanks again for all the help.
    Last edited by gearhead1; 02-27-2014 at 09:09 PM.

  14. #14
    Super Moderator Six_Shooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gearhead1 View Post
    Six_Shooter- You talked me into it...Just ordered the burn2

    You guys have any tips for this burner?

    Thanks again for all the help.
    Tip?

    Use it. That's about the only thing to keep in mind.

    Glad I could help. I DO recommend getting the Ostrich 2.0 once you can afford it, real time tuning is a lot of fun and a LOT quicker than the EEPROM swapping that is the way you will be doing it now. That being said, I know quite a few people who have tuned their cars very well without emulation.
    The man who says something is impossible, is usually interrupted by the man doing it.

  15. #15
    Fuel Injected!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Six_Shooter View Post
    I DO recommend getting the Ostrich 2.0 once you can afford it, real time tuning is a lot of fun and a LOT quicker than the EEPROM swapping that is the way you will be doing it now.
    I'm tempted to pull out a credit card..........

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