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Thread: 16168625 BHAN modifications for TBI to TPI conversion questions>>

  1. #16
    Fuel Injected! bybyc5's Avatar
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    In searching more I found this thread here http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...r-Spread-Sheet and see there is an excel spread sheet for use with TunerPro RT that someone was kind enough to write.

    Guess when I get it running, I should get this program (TunerPro RT) as well, and learn how to data log with it, and then modify the VE tables.
    Just never have been to excel savy..

    I have a snap on live data scanner (Solus) that I use for tuning information, and datamaster for my LT1 stuff, but the TunerPro RT looks like it's well worth the $39.

    There is a lot of knowledge here..just have to keep digging and looking...

    Thank you,

    Keith

  2. #17
    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
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    Your putting it all together fast. Here's a thread on how to use the spreadsheet. It looks long at first. With data in hand it only takes me 5 minutes to redo VE tables from spreadsheet.
    http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...-data-Tutorial!

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  3. #18
    Fuel Injected! bybyc5's Avatar
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    That is a nice tutorial on the VE tuning, and TunerPro RT.
    Thank you for the link!


    Now I just have to get far enough along to use it.


    Still in process of swapping the intake manifold, and running fuel lines from the high pressure pump I am using.


    I had to swap out the TBI accessory brackets for TPI ones that allow room out the front for the throttle body.


    And installing an LT1 dual electric fan set up on the radiator.


    So it may be a couple weeks or so before I get to turn the key.


    It's all fun stuff, just takes some time to get it the way I want.


    I will take some pics when finished.


    I will keep notes on what works out with the PCM modifications, what was done and all. For future reference.


    Again, Thank you all for the help!!


    Keith

  4. #19
    Fuel Injected! bybyc5's Avatar
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    I finally finished the nuts and bolts part of the swap, and began tuning the PCM.


    After making the resistor jumper, and memcal jumper in the PCM. Read out a fresh copy of the stock BHAS bin, used the “flag /switch” and under the “general tab” I made those changes described in the “TBI to MPFI ZIP” (Thank you for that!!)
    Burned the first chip and tried it. Initial start up was fuel laden, but once lit up, ran rather well. Actually better than expected!


    Once started, motor runs fine. No dtc's set. Fuel trims at idle and part throttle good hovering just over and under 128.
    Hot idle pulse width's are 1 to 2 ms.


    Really impressed with the low rpm improvements, and the seat ofthe pants feel of the increased torque.
    It is really fun to drive.


    Cranking pulse width's for a brief moment immediately after turning the key to crank, start at 12 ms then drop down. This causes a slight flooding condition.
    Warm starts are a little trickier, due to not needing as much fueling.


    If I hold the gas pedal ½ way down and crank the motor, it starts good. But I shouldn't need to do that.


    Key on, engine off shows IAC at step position 150.


    Looking for tables that control cranking AFR, or pulse width's.


    Trying to decipher the function of some of these tables is challenging for me. If I better understood the definition, or explanation, I could easier determine which table to modify and how.


    I found a nice list of acronym definitions here on gearhead given by EagleMark, which I already understand most all of these, but haven't found a mask parameter definition list...is there such a thing? I see the notes using TunerPro RT, and hitting the fn/key and f-10 key gives a short note about what ever parameter your viewing at that time. But most of these are brief, and some have no notes at all.


    Example:
    Crank BPW vs Temperature Scalar Table. The “stock” setting is 123.49
    What does the 123.49 represent, and how does it effect this table.
    I understand what Crank Base Pulse Width, and temperature is, but the rest eludes me. How does the 123.49 effect the Temperature Scalar table, and can I look at this table? Where might it be?


    I am going to play with this table today and see what gives. I would like to be able to understand this rather than just move numbers around until it starts right.


    A Really BIG THANK YOU!!! to all here for freely giving help to guys like me, learning and doing projects like we love to do.
    I know EagleMark, And Six_Shooter, Dave W, JeepsAndGuns, have helped me and I appreciate this.


    I have been keeping good notes, and when done (I know there never really done) will compile all and zip it. I don't know if anyone here has a data base to store project notes like these, but if you want it to help the next person going down a similar path, I'll give it to you when done?


    Thank you,
    Keith


    383 TPI almost done.jpg
    Last edited by bybyc5; 09-27-2013 at 02:42 PM. Reason: copy to paste from OpenOffice to this reply to post box left some grammar errors.

  5. #20
    RIP EagleMark's Avatar
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    Thanks for the kind words to everyone! Glad your on the way to success!

    The definitions are a project from JeepsandGuns so thanks need to go to him on that project.

    Parameter comments are another thing and if not done in the mask ID/XDF well it's just some things you need to learn, and a lot of them could be learned but there's so many things in these new XDF that should never really be touched.

    Your rich/flood condition is common when going to MPFI. BHAS is $E6 ? Kind of hard to do this in $E6 as I don't think theres a CPI bin for them?

    So try this, open $0D and a similar bin to yours, then use the compare fetaure and find a 4.3L CPI bin. Compare a couple tables "Open Loop AFR vs. Temperature vs. Vacuum" and "Crank to Run AFR vs. Temperature" You'll see big differences in what TBI needs compared to CPI.

    Open another instance of TunerPRo, Tools Custom, New TP Instance and load your bin and XDF, then copy the tables from the CPI bin above and paste them into yours. This should calm down the rich/flood cold/hot start issues quite a bit. These are the 2 I start with.

    Cold start and hot restart seem to be the hardest things to dial in when I've done these MPFI conversions. You really only get one shot a day for the cold start. When you get that done the hot restart is also improved!

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  6. #21
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    i normally tune cold starts with a cold garden hose plumbed to the engine no radiator LOL doesnt take long to pull all the heat back out and have another go :D

  7. #22
    Fuel Injected! bybyc5's Avatar
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    My mistake, Thank You to JeepsAndGuns for those definitions!!

    I wonder if parameter comments are editable? Can I add notes to the XDF or ADX as I go along learning what the ones do I use?

    I will explore TunerPro RT more and more as I use it. It is a really great program, and has what seems like endless possibilities.
    I do keep written notes the old fashioned way though..pen and paper!

    I did manage to get at least the warm engine start issue to go away. Waiting for this morning to try the cold start. (Although the garden hose idea was tempting yesterday afternoon!!)

    I changed the stock value in the " Crank BPW vs Temperature Scalar Table" from 123.49 to 50, which tunerPro changed to 51.22. Guessing that small change was for the checksum?

    I will try your suggestion opening another session of TunerPro, didn't realize that was possible. And investigate comparing those tables.

    Then my next challenge will be to record data logging, and get my VE tables tweaked. Shouldn't be to far off I hope. It does drive really well.
    I'll get a chance now to try that VE fixer spread sheet you gave me a link to, that Dave W made! ( Thanks Dave W! )

    I did buy a G3 and some of those 4 mb chips from Craig, and the remote bin changer control.
    I can't imagine 8 different bins for this truck. But I do have 4 different ones in mind.

    Looks like there is some more learning and data logging in my near future!

    Again, I appreciate all the help!

    Thank you,
    Keith
    Last edited by bybyc5; 09-28-2013 at 01:55 PM.

  8. #23
    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
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    The definations were not all just from me, it was a group effort by all of us here. I'm glad someone could use it!

    If you want to add to or change the parameter comments, simply right click on the parameter and select edit.

    Not really sure what to tell you on the cranking/flooding part, as I did not have this issue on my conversion. But if your holding the throttle open and its starting good, then something definately needs adjusted down. Cause if I am not mistaken, opening the throttle any during cranking puts the ecm into clear flood mode and drasticly reduces the fuel being injected.
    Not sure about $E6, but I know $0D has several cranking, crank to run, and start parameters. So maybe try a $0D bin if you have not already.
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