first time start up!

[sgtpoliteness]

If I were to adjust the AE MAP and AE TPS are those the ones in 'Tables' for Tuner Pro? They're in micro seconds.

[EagleMark]

That's the ones.

[babywag]

I try and avoid LHM but That brings up another issue! IIRC timing in LHM is locked at 20 like you said, If base is set to 10 and you do enter LHM, timing will be 30...

The bigger the cam the more idle spark it needs along with some more RPM. Even a stock cam in these older engines idles much better at 700-750 RPM.

LOL while not ideal 30* isn't unreasonable if you keep it light on the go pedal.
Think about it...old school 10* initial advance + vacuum advance 16* = 26* light load on engine.
Stock specs call for about that for total timing on an AMC 360 anyway.
They're pretty snappy set-up like this w/ carb & stock distributor.

Now if you're set @ 0* initial it's going to suck and from idle-2000 you probably won't be able to move.
AMC no likey no timing advance idle-2000

[sgtpoliteness]

Just to update all you kind fellows...

I made a couple adjustments to the bin yesterday evening. I increased AE MAP and AE TPS (4B40 and 4B45) each by 50%. This helped with driveability for sure. It popped back thru the t-body once and I'm still pretty low on low end power. But we're getting there! I'm still getting the crazy '25000' for spark advance under high load, mid-rpm conditions.

I'm looking at the main spark table and am curious how others normally adjust it. Do you add '1' to the whole thing? Add to a column or line? Or just add a little here and there?

Here are a couple logs and my latest bin if anyone is interested.

[babywag]

Just to update all you kind fellows...

I made a couple adjustments to the bin yesterday evening. I increased AE MAP and AE TPS (4B40 and 4B45) each by 50%. This helped with driveability for sure. It popped back thru the t-body once and I'm still pretty low on low end power. But we're getting there! I'm still getting the crazy '25000' for spark advance under high load, mid-rpm conditions.

I'm looking at the main spark table and am curious how others normally adjust it. Do you add '1' to the whole thing? Add to a column or line? Or just add a little here and there?

Here are a couple logs and my latest bin if anyone is interested.

You need to get your fuel (VE tables) dialed in before playing with timing and AE.
They're all over the place.
BLM's are ~105-~140 your pig rich is some areas and really lean in others.
Popping through the TBI is lean and I'm guessing you can really feel the lack of power?

jasonblm.jpg

For reference a BLM of 137.941 = AFR ~15.85
Look @ rpm 1200/1600 MAP 60

[sgtpoliteness]

Ok, copy that. I'll mess with the VE tables during the day today on the spreadsheet.

Yeah, major lack of power.

[babywag]

Where is your ignition module mounted?
Long run of wires?

Make sure it's grounded properly and if the wires are long try twisting them like twisted pair wiring.
You could be picking up noise on them? Keep them away from the coil & plug wires too.

[sgtpoliteness]

That's a good idea. It's mounted on the passenger side fender well, near where I put the MAP and right above the starter solenoid. I bet I've got 2+ feet of wire between the coil and ignition module. I've also read that I shouldn't have the MAP sensor so far away from the t-body. Is this true?

[EagleMark]

MAP seems to be working fine.

But you have ignition issues! Spark advance of 8 degrees? Then when you hit the throttle it goes off chart then to 0? Wiring? Ground? Where's the EST mounted? What coil? What distributor?

Pictures of conversion under hood and I can spot issues easier then asking for little details you may not think are relevant.

[babywag]

MAP seems to be working fine.

But you have ignition issues! Spark advance of 8 degrees? Then when you hit the throttle it goes off chart then to 0? Wiring? Ground? Where's the EST mounted? What coil? What distributor?

Pictures of conversion under hood and I can spot issues easier then asking for little details you may not think are relevant.

The stock bin has a bias setting somewhere that sucks out ~10* initial advance.
I'll see if I can remember the value to change in the bin.
Drove me nuts until I found it.

Are you running the large Ford TFI style cap? I had random 23k spark advance issues running one.
After I removed it never saw one again.

[sgtpoliteness]

The ignition module is mounted on the RF fender well, probably 2 feet from the coil. I've confirmed the ground is good and wiring is clean and secure. I'll take a couple pictures at lunch and post them.

[babywag]

Yep...
Main Spark Bias change it from 9.8 to 0 in your bin or change the xdf file.

Spark advance should display correctly on the dash then.
Drove me nuts until I found that setting when I did mine.

[sgtpoliteness]

Yep...
Main Spark Bias change it from 9.8 to 0 in your bin or change the xdf file.

Spark advance should display correctly on the dash then.
Drove me nuts until I found that setting when I did mine.

Changed it just now. Thanks!!

Here are those pics.

[EagleMark]

Whoa! Wait a minute. In $0D Spark Advance table the Spark Bias is automatically removed from Main Spark Advance Table. So what you see is actual spark advance. If you remove the 9.8 bias you just increased Spark Advance by 9.8 degrees in the entire table!!! Go look at before and after Bias change, have to re-open Spark Advance table to see it!

Now if you have your base distributor timing set to anything other then 0? Then you have to add that amount to $0D ADX file Spark Advance Conversion to see accurate spark advance. So if you set distributor base to 10? Then adx is off by 10. and the Bias removed would make it look right, but you'd be 20 degrees to far advanced!

I've said this before and I'm sure I'll say it again... "So where did you say your timing was set?"

Always verify timing at timing marks with a timing light!

[EagleMark]

I see a couple potential issues with wiring. First is anywhere you have crimps can be a problem either now or later. If you can't solder connections use metal crimps with no plastic cover and shrink wrap.

Are those grounds on fender well anything to do with EFI? If so, no go! Have to be back to block. Even if you have ground straps from engine to frame to body to... the ground plane will be different.

Those wires from EST/ICM module? Couple possible issues, if that one big red wire to solenoid id from alternator? That is a horrible source of RFI/EMI = electrical noise!

The other issue with the wires from EST/ICM is they are way to close to or touching spark plug wires, again way to much electrical noise.

I think the MAP is OK over there, it's way less susceptible to noise and also farther from the source of electrical noise. I did not see any MAP data issues. But use the same theory for it's wires and all EFI wiring, away from coil, coil wire, spark plug wires and the charge wire from altenator.

One more issue is the EST/ICM is so very close to your regulator, it is another horrible cause of electrical noise. Looks like the EST/ICM ground may be hitting it and then run to fender well for ground where regulator is?

I think those issues with wiring from EST/ICM is your cause of Spark Timing issues, your talking about wires that transfer a 5 volt square wave signal which changes to change your timing.

Now I've also seen Duraspark modules do some weird things with timing, but never fail. Here's how to test the Duraspark module inside the distributor. You do have vacuum and mechanical advance locked out right?
http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...TBI-Conversion

Now when you set the distributor base timing to 0 with bypass wire disconnected, then connect the bypass where is timing? In a stock bin file it should be about 16 degrees advance. If the two wires from Duraspark module are swapped it won't be.