NEEDED: 16197427 5.7L Manual Trans bin

[EagleMark]

So at this point I think I am sticking with 7.4L Manual $OE bin since I've done a lot to it already in preparation for start up, actually even burned a 27Fs512 chip for G1 Moates adapter. Harness is going in today, been tinkering, collecting parts, etc... this week.

Have stock fuel lines from TBI truck we are going to run back to tank. Greg is coming over with a bucket type in tank pump that may work, it's a very short unit he says. This tank is only 7-8 inches tall, not to wide and very long!

[JeepsAndGuns]

So at this point I think I am sticking with 7.4L Manual $OE bin

I think thats a good choice.
I am looking forward to updates as you get it running and tune it.

[belaw]

So at this point I think I am sticking with 7.4L Manual $OE bin since I've done a lot to it already in preparation for start up, actually even burned a 27Fs512 chip for G1 Moates adapter. Harness is going in today, been tinkering, collecting parts, etc... this week.

Have stock fuel lines from TBI truck we are going to run back to tank. Greg is coming over with a bucket type in tank pump that may work, it's a very short unit he says. This tank is only 7-8 inches tall, not to wide and very long!

Any updates?

Also, do you know if the 7.4 uses a speed sensor, or are idle functions all controlled by the software? I'm in the planning stages of a TBI conversion on a 350 with manual transmission (and no speed sensor) and I would prefer to use a P4 ECM. The one (only?) benefit of a C3 processor is that bin's are available with dedicated idle routines for a manual tranny.

[EagleMark]

Not really?

There is no 5.7L Manual bins made for 16197427 any mask, they were different ECM. There are 7.4L manual bins for 16197427 $0E and that's what I used. Very easy to change to 5.7L.

It runs very well without VSS but I would not recommend it or do it again, to much work but I wanted to prove it could be done because a butthead somewhere else said it couldn't. We have also come up with theory of easier way, but untested theory only. VSS can be added to speedo cable for around $75. from couple different places.

[belaw]

There is no 5.7L Manual bins made for 16197427 any mask, they were different ECM. There are 7.4L manual bins for 16197427 $0E and that's what I used. Very easy to change to 5.7L.

This is good news for me! I'm new to TBI and still in the learning stage; I was concerned that editing the 7.4 bin for use on a 5.7 would be more "reprograming" than tuning.

It runs very well without VSS but I would not recommend it or do it again, to much work but I wanted to prove it could be done because a butthead somewhere else said it couldn't. We have also come up with theory of easier way, but untested theory only. VSS can be added to speedo cable for around $75. from couple different places.

Why do you recommend against not using VSS? What problems does it present? I know that I could add a VSS, but I have a Classic Instruments electronic speedomenter and 16 pulse sender. To use VSS I would have to pitch the sender, buy the VSS and then a digital signal converter box for about $100 that would allow the speedometer to use the 2 pulse VSS signal

[EagleMark]

Fairly easy to change an $0D, $0E etc... bin to differant size engine. The bin itself is fairly complex as to idle and off idle tables! Most of which are speed based along with TPS%. Every EFI conversion I have done without VSS was better with. $0D/$0E was the hardest to make run and drive without side effects because of no VSS!

I've never dealt with digatal speedo issues? But why can't you just add another VSS? Why not put 2 in a short speedo cable? Or wonder if the VSS signal you have can be split? It can be adjusted in bin...

I'd never attempt to run these PCM again without VSS, way to much tuning work for $75. I tune live with AutoProm and I'll bet I added 6 hours to a simple tune because of no VSS.

[belaw]

I posted a similar question in the TBI forum on TGO and received the following reply:

That's not true - surprisingly P4 PCM was used with LO5 and manual trany in G20 and G30 vans and step vans. Partial list of calibrations provided below.

Word of advise - P4 PCM can be used with any trany (MT/THM350/700R4/4L60E, 80E). You may need to incorporate SA and AE changes into a baseline AT bin file to make PCM play nice with a manual gearbox.

BDTZ 1994 16168625 G2 L05 5.7 MAN GU6
BDUA 1994 16168625 G2 L05 5.7 MAN GT4
BJYH 1995 16197427 G2 L05 5.7 MAN GT4
BJYJ 1995 16197427 G3 L05 5.7 MAN GU5
BJYN 1995 16197427 G2 L05 5.7 MAN GU6
BJYP 1995 16197427 G2 L05 5.7 MAN GT4
BJYR 1995 16197427 G3 L05 5.7 MAN GU5
BJYZ 1995 16197427 G2 L05 5.7 MAN GT4
BJZH 1995 16197427 P3 L05 5.7 MAN
BJZP 1995 16197427 P3 L05 5.7 MAN

//RF

I can't vouch for the accuracy of this information but thought I would share

[EagleMark]

I've seen that and others but none ever panned out. Like BJZP does not exist in Cal Data and says it's an Auto in BCC Find?
http://www.gearhead-efi.com/BCCFind/...shtml?BCC=BJZP
BJZH is an Export (open loop) that has been superseded to one that has no info? BJYZ is one we thought to have a good story as the 16197427 PCM was needed for Cal emissions because of pintle EGR, it is superseded twice to even a different PCM?

Others have said to be 5.7L Manual but when looked at they were Auto, like BJZH in BCC Find:
http://www.gearhead-efi.com/BCCFind/...shtml?BCC=BJZH

Every bin I ever checked was an Auto bin and did not even have the Manual bitmask checked.

So let me rephrase that, they may be there but no one has yet to see one? So maybe if we can find a G20-30-35 manual stepvan in Cal from 1994-95?

Have to remember this was state of the art PCM designed for Auto Trans, why would it be used in a manual? I think OBDII was coming and GM ran out of cheaper ECMs and used up what was left? Just a theory... along with pintle valve EGR needed for CA emissions, again just a theory, no proof or bin yet.

Anyway it's to easy to make another Manual bin work in these PCM, unlike C3 ECM bins which are readily available to start with. 4.3L or 7.4L Manual = available and EZ.

I gave up looking for the ghost bin...

[CenTexBiker]

I know this is an old thread.... still looking for a 5.7 with 5 speed? That is my 1990

[EagleMark]

1990 would be the wrong ECM...

[CenTexBiker]

Isnt the code same for 7747 and 7427. Sorry i am a noob

[PJG1173]

no very much different.

[CenTexBiker]

no very much different.

So why dont they want it? They have been lookung for 2 years.

Alao maybe you can help: the bin from the L05 export with manual, will that work as an update for a vortec with tbi?

[EagleMark]

The one you have is for a differant ECM. Each ECM/PCM has differant code called a Mask, otherwise known as an Operating System. So it won't work in a 16197427 PCM.

Don't start with a bin marked Export. These were exported to countries that had leaded fuel and can't run an O2 sensor so they are always Open Loop.

[CenTexBiker]

Aahhh gotcha. Thanks for the info