More questions about closed loop operation and tuning software........

[damanx]

These are probably stupid questions that a search could easily answer, but my google-fu and patience are sucking today.

In my other thread titled "woohoo"..., I mentioned that I got an eprom programmer and have loaded a prom with a modified bin.

I was planning on runnning tunerpro and getting a log, but my laptop did not want to play tonight and ignored the usb ports. Vista blows arse.

So I used my old toughbook with a serial port and a touch screen, which makes life so much easier when driving and wanting to look at different screens.

I have two different programs on that one since it's 98 and it can't run tunerpro. WinAldl and Turbolink, Turbolink is more detailed and graphic oriented with a lot of information being shown in guage format as well as recording capability. (It seems that the preferred software to use here is Tunerpro, which I think is awesome, but my inability and lack of patience to use it is strictly the fault of the laptop I have, NOT the software.)

First issue was WinAldl showing that blm cells updating, but nothing on the int tables. Worked just fine with the original bin. I closed Winaldl and opened turbolink, lo and behold, I see blm and int numbers changing. So, something must be going on.

1st question: I should see changing numbers, both BLM and INT, when in closed loop mode, correct?

Next, I set the EGR enabled water temp to 255, but see that may be incorrect. I set Min MPH for EGR to 105mph and EGR Disabled Under MPH to 104. This was to shut off EGR operation.

2nd question: Should both number be the same, or does the ECM not care about gap between 104 and 105?

Next up is regarding knock counts. Running the 2.8l bin, I was seeing knock counts in the 250 ranges and you could hear it. I backed the timing off and the counts dropped by about half. I installed the 4.3l prom with original bin and dropped the knock counts by almost 2/3. I then installed a prom with a modified bin and dropped the knock counts down to less than 8 total for the drive in, and this even included a stomp the gas at 60 for a few seconds.

3rd question: What amount of knock counts is considered normal as I know that I don't see knocks from noises other than actual knocking.

That's it for the moment.

[34blazer]

regarding WinALDL, are you using the wide avg table? theres a way to select how you want to see the data(sample counts) with the tab at the bottom. using wide avg will save more samples, not sure how many though.


regarding knock, IMO zero knock counts is acceptable. audible knock is really bad, but can still get knock that you cant hear. keep spark advance conservative while you dial in the fuel first. im sure you matched your base timing to the value in the bin first?

[damanx]

Yes, I verified that the distributor is set to 0 degrees as it's 0 degrees for the "Initial Advance" setting in the bin.

And no, I totally forgot about the drop down selections......

[EagleMark]

1st question: I should see changing numbers, both BLM and INT, when in closed loop mode, correct?

Yes.

From the EFI Dictionary:
http://www.gearhead-efi.com/gm-ecm-p...ictionary.html

INT = The short term fuel trim value is called the Integrator The value of the integrator varies above and below 128 with 128 being no correction. For example, if the Integrator is 135, the ECM is adding fuel because the 02 sensor is reading a lean mixture. If the Integrator is 110, the ECM is removing fuel because the 02 sensor is reading a rich mixture. Anytime the system is not in closed loop, the Integrator will immediately return to a value of 128 and stay there.

BLM = Block Learn Multiplier. Block Learn Mode term is long term fuel trim. BLM value tracks the Integrator but has a delay. If the Integrator increases so does the BLM, but the BLM lags behind the Integrator. The higher the Integrator climbs above 128, the faster the BLM rises. BLM value affects the VE table by adding fuel above 128 and subtracting fuel below 128

You really need to assure the EGR is off and get rid of knock counts, especially if you can hear knock! Plus you have an ESC test that will come into play on top of all these knock counts you have during PE!

        ;---------------------------------------------
        ; ERROR 43
        ;
        ; ESC FAIL
        ;---------------------------------------------
LD52E   FCB  0      ; 0 SEC ENG RUN TIME PRIOR TO TEST
LD52F   FCB  120    ; Min time since run enable, (120 sec)
LD530   FCB  235    ; PA count limit
LD531   FCB  23     ; EST fail test period, (2.3 sec)
LD532   FCB  20     ; TEST DURATION
					;
LD533   FCB  48     ; COLD LMT            
LD534   FCB  39     ; HOT LMT
					;
LD535   FCB  128    ; 3200 RPM LMT
LD536   FCB  195    ; 82.3 Kpa MAP LMT, (BPT )

                ;--------------------------
                ; SPK ADV TO FORCE A KNOCK
                ;--------------------------
LD537   FCB  23     ;  8 DEG, 1st PE MODE
LD538   FCB  43     ; 15 DEG, 2nd PE MODE
LD539   FCB  2      ; KNK ACCUM LIMIT
        ;---------------------------------------------

Now if you were running $42 you could run the ESC Done patch and not have to worry about forced knock! And would have exact settings for EGR disable. Or continue to develop ways to do this in $4E...

[damanx]

Yes, I do want to eventually run the 1227747 ecm I have, but I am weak in the programming area and want to learn more before I go deeper and just start throwing stuff in the truck, if that makes any sense.

[EagleMark]

Nope, makes no sense at all to use a rare and hardly documented ECM over one that is completely covered and used by everyone including aftermarket TBI systems companies for 20 years?

Your engine never came with that ECM and there's no bin for it? Why start there?