I know this is a really old post but gettin the truck close to buttoned up anyways went with the 90 350 motor, bored 40 over, lunati barebones cam, vortec heads, edelbrock carbed intake with tbi adapter, and 700r4 trans im wondering what computer to buy 16197427 or 1227747 ? or some other ? and will it run without being programmed or will it have to be programmed first ? thanks !!
76 scottsdale 4x4
76 nova 383
The 1227747 is more forgiving in programming than the 16197427. With the 1227747, the VSS can be deleted by grounding the park / neutral wire. The 1227747 is simple with only one fuel and spark table compared to the 16197427 having two fuel and spark tables to tune. The 16197427 is more than capable of the all challenges of the modifed 350 engine will cause either computer. Bottom line, the more you know about the programming with either computer, the better the engine will PERFORM!Originally Posted by BIGWORM76
dave w
I am running pretty much the same set up as you in my Jeep and I am using the 7747. I had Dave tune the the chip for me and I have a lot of trust in Dave's opinion so if he feels like the 7747 would be a better choice that is the way I would go if I were you.
Got to have a VSS for the 700R4 TCC to work.
1227747 came with 700R4. The 16197427 came with 4L60E and 4L80E trans, but can be made to work with 700R4. 16197427 is a better PCM, but much more complicated in tuning then a 1227747 ECM.
Most people would not notice then difference in the way the truck runs and drives with either ECM/PCM.
I'd always choose a 1227747 ECM unless I needed a 16197427 for the E trans.
1227747 with a V8 stock chip will run the motor! May set codes depending on chip and engine emissions like EGR or Air or? Still won't run near as good as it should without a proper tune for your new Vortec head engine.
HTH!
1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
-= =-
Just my personal opinon having tuned 3 different TBI ECM codes. The $42 is junk, $99 is much better than $42 and $0D is worlds above both.
This is where I differ, I would ALWAYS choose the 7427. Idle is better, PCM adaptions and long term fuel trim handling is better, etc. Power enrichment settings can be tweaked, etc. You can adapt over a MAT sensor or IAT sensor with the 7427 as well. The 7427 also has unused outputs that can control E-fans, Nitrous, and even a PWM control.
Last edited by Fast355; 04-18-2013 at 06:58 PM.
I would have to agree with Fast here. After having converted my truck from '7747 to '7427, and building my camaro's '7427 system from scratch, I would recommend the '7427 for all the reasons above. The install is not that much different, or much more difficult, but the data stream ability, and tuning parameters are well worth it.
1978 Camaro Type LT, 383, Dual TBI, '7427, 4L80E
1981 Camaro Z-28 Clone, T-Tops, 350/TH350
1981 Camaro Berlinetta, V-6, 3spd
1974 Chevy/GMC Truck, '90 TBI 350, '7427, TH350, NP203, 6" lift, 35s
Have you pinned a wideband into the linear EGR position pin and datalogged wideband readings from the datastream yet?
Last edited by Fast355; 04-18-2013 at 07:29 PM.
If you're familiar with tuning, the 16197427 PCM is DEFINITELY the way to go. IMHO, if you're just starting out and aren't super comfortable with tuning, the 1227747 is a good start. And you can easily "upgrade" later.
It was my experience that the '7427 idles better and the faster data rate made tuning much easier.
Familiar with 1227747 and 16197427 PCMs
Not to mention you do not have to patch needed paramaters into the datastream, such as injector PW, duty cycle and timing.
You guys have also been at this a long time, he's just starting.
$42 for 1227747 has more detailed tuning notes to learn what Parameters do then any mask made so not only is it simple. It's a learning tool.
Idle is not an issue if you set it up right, there's loads of info on net how to do it wrong!
As far as patches it's not hard to click Apply...
Either way you can't go wrong. 16197427 is a newer faster PCM, but you'll never notice the difference unless you had an earlier 1227747, even then it's subtle if both are set right. In my Suburban I run $42, $99, $61 and have tried a few others, also have an adapter to run $0D. I can make them all run fine, wife asks so what computer and I driving today?
If you get more and more involved the 16197427 has more tricks up it's sleeve, also has a bazillion parameters that don't need to be touched. These have got a lot of people in trouble.
But I still can't get fuel mileage as high with any but $42. Better in town and blown away on freeway trips at 19.5, 17.5 without Lean Cruise. Best I can get out of 16197427 $0D is 16.5 ? Which matches my 1998 Vortec PCM and 0411 PCM swap at 16.5 MPG. 0411 with lean cruise drops to 14.5...
1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
-= =-
Not sure why you are having MPG issues with the 7427.....I was getting 21 mpg highway with my G20 and TPI 305 with the 7427 and pushing a brick down the highway matching the 7730.You guys have also been at this a long time, he's just starting.
$42 for 1227747 has more detailed tuning notes to learn what Parameters do then any mask made so not only is it simple. It's a learning tool.
Idle is not an issue if you set it up right, there's loads of info on net how to do it wrong!
As far as patches it's not hard to click Apply...
Either way you can't go wrong. 16197427 is a newer faster PCM, but you'll never notice the difference unless you had an earlier 1227747, even then it's subtle if both are set right. In my Suburban I run $42, $99, $61 and have tried a few others, also have an adapter to run $0D. I can make them all run fine, wife asks so what computer and I driving today?
If you get more and more involved the 16197427 has more tricks up it's sleeve, also has a bazillion parameters that don't need to be touched. These have got a lot of people in trouble.
But I still can't get fuel mileage as high with any but $42. Better in town and blown away on freeway trips at 19.5, 17.5 without Lean Cruise. Best I can get out of 16197427 $0D is 16.5 ? Which matches my 1998 Vortec PCM and 0411 PCM swap at 16.5 MPG. 0411 with lean cruise drops to 14.5...
Last edited by Fast355; 04-18-2013 at 09:08 PM.
Mark,
Have you tried Psuedo open loop and using the $42 o2 voltage settings on your $OD setup?? GM moved the 02 sensor on the later model trucks to behind the Y pipe and the settings are different. On a second note the 0411 settings at low load result in the mixture being richer than necessary at low loads and leaner at heavy part throttle. I bring my PE in at 40% on most of my stuff and tend to run o2 calibrations from TPI vettes. Lean at light loading, about like a TBI truck with moderate loads and rich like a TPI at heavier loading. Makes a difference you can see. I can take a tune that is practically perfect, move the 02 settings and watch the long terms move around.
Have you added timing to the 0411s AFR timing correction tables?
Last edited by Fast355; 04-18-2013 at 10:08 PM.
The "Open Loop AFR Enable" ? No. I don't get a lot of time in the Suburban anymore, it's the wife's driver now, if I'm playing with something and have time I have to make sure it starts cold and drives as normal the next day with no issues if I leave something in there.... or the wife has a fit when she has to plug the stock ECM back in!
Wife says: "I'm going shopping today... what ECM am I driving?" I say, yes dear, it's the perfect stock one, no surprises... then if she finds out I'm using here for testing and there's an issue? Well no dinner for me...
Then she want's to take my truck the next day.. I say OK, let me flash in a non test tune! She then takes the suburban...
When we bought this 10 years ago I promised her we could have a stock family daily driver after 17 years of marriage. She conceded to the ECM if I left the stock one alone to plug in. I did have to take out some spark as she said it's to snappy and hurts here neck taking off from a traffic light...She still does not know it's not stock, just less timing low end...
She found out I don't do Fords and wants one! I said Cool! Now I have a ford to learn on!
OK That was fun, back on topic...
There is a huge difference in INT Delay between 1227747 and 16197427 because of O2 sensor placement from factory.
On the 0411 I think my last settings for O2 swing are all at .451 where I set them for data logging. Initial results back with 92 octane and high octane spark table in low octane table and no Lean Cruise is producing much better results in mileage. Also a big difference in power as noticed in how far my big foot has to push the go pedal! I want to finish this tank and maybe try Lean Cruise again with high test fuel.
1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
-= =-
I run 93 in my L31 with the 0411 swap and do not have access to enable lean cruise. My low load targets are 350 and rise up to 630 under load.The "Open Loop AFR Enable" ? No. I don't get a lot of time in the Suburban, if I'm playing with something and have time I have to make sure it starts cold and drives as normal the next day with no issues if I leave something in there.... or the wife has a fit when she has to plug the stock ECM back in!
There is a huge difference in INT Delay between 1227747 and 16197427 because of O2 sensor placement from factory.
On the 0411 I think my last settings for O2 swing are all at .451 where I set them for data logging. Initial results back with 92 octane and high octane spark table in low octane table and no Lean Cruise is producing much better results in mileage. Also a big difference in power as noticed in how far my big foot has to push the go pedal! I want to finish this tank and maybe try Lean Cruise again with high test fuel.
I stuck a timing map in my L31 that was loosely based on the B-car LT1 and ran my old TPI van well. It flat woke it up! Stock black box was getting 12-13 mpg, my tweaked black box 13-14 and the tuned 0411 15-16 on my daily driving. I saw 489 miles on 24.8 gallons on a trip to South Padre this last spring break.
Last edited by Fast355; 04-18-2013 at 10:21 PM.
eagle mark, when are you going to release that v 5.8 xdl file?
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