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Thread: All O2 sensors created equal?

  1. #1
    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
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    All O2 sensors created equal?

    I was wondering if most all narrow band o2 sensors are created pretty much equil?
    My cherokee seems to want to run at around 13.5 afr about 90-95% of the time once in closed loop. It will come up to around 14.7 for a while every now and then, but then usally adjusts itself back down to closer to 13.5.
    I found that if I hooked the simulated NB output of my MTX-L to the ecm, once in closed loop it will stay at almost a perfect and steady 14.7. BUT, after a couple days, I get a error code for o2 sensor failure. I reset the pcm and all is well again for a couple more days. When I hook the NB back up, I never get any error codes, but I get the 13.5 afr.

    So, could it be the bosch o2 sensor I am using? Are the output voltages different based on what applacation they are intended for? Its a 4 wire heated sensor, not from a chevy. You think swapping to a 3 wire ac delco (or something simillar) made for vehicle that came factory with a 7427 would help?
    Thoughts, ideas?
    79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy

    93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver

    99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.

  2. #2
    EFI tuning addict 96lt4c4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeepsAndGuns View Post
    I was wondering if most all narrow band o2 sensors are created pretty much equil?
    My cherokee seems to want to run at around 13.5 afr about 90-95% of the time once in closed loop. It will come up to around 14.7 for a while every now and then, but then usally adjusts itself back down to closer to 13.5.
    I found that if I hooked the simulated NB output of my MTX-L to the ecm, once in closed loop it will stay at almost a perfect and steady 14.7. BUT, after a couple days, I get a error code for o2 sensor failure. I reset the pcm and all is well again for a couple more days. When I hook the NB back up, I never get any error codes, but I get the 13.5 afr.

    So, could it be the bosch o2 sensor I am using? Are the output voltages different based on what applacation they are intended for? Its a 4 wire heated sensor, not from a chevy. You think swapping to a 3 wire ac delco (or something simillar) made for vehicle that came factory with a 7427 would help?
    Thoughts, ideas?
    Depending on where your 02 is in the exhaust. The bosch sensors are garbage. Get you a 3 wire heated sensor, AC Delco. Get one for a 94 full size chevy truck. You will go into closed loop sooner and you should see 14.7 AFR.

    -1999 Hugger Orange SS, LS2 402 T56, 9 inch Ford 3.90 gears, Tuned with HP Tuners
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  3. #3
    EFI tuning addict 96lt4c4's Avatar
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    The truck I just got done tuning was throwing the 02 code 13. The 12 volt line to the sensor was bad keeping the heater off. I fixed the 12 volt line, no more code and its going into closed loop at idle now, runs way better.

    -1999 Hugger Orange SS, LS2 402 T56, 9 inch Ford 3.90 gears, Tuned with HP Tuners
    -2002 Cavalier, Tuned with HP Tuners
    -1994 Full Size Blazer ,383 TBI 4L60E, 4.10's, Tuned with Tunerpro RT (Where it all began)

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    Delco or Denso(they seem to be the real manufacturer of the Delcos) is the way to go. us FWD'ers also avoid Bosch sensors like the plague due to the same issues.

    from what it's been rumored in the past, the Bosch sensors respond differently than the Delco units. while it could probably be accounted for in the calibration, it's just a lot easier to use the part the calibration was setup for.
    1995 Chevrolet Monte Carlo LS 3100 + 4T60E


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    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
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    Sounds like its time to hit up rockauto and order one.
    79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy

    93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver

    99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.

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    Fuel Injected! woody80z28's Avatar
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    I agree. My Bosch o2 from Napa sucked. Got a Denso online and immediately helped a ton.
    80 Camaro Z28 - 550hp AFR 383 / T56 6spd (Holley HP EFI)
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    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
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    Just ordered a AC delco from amazon.com. They actually had a slightly better price on it than rockauto.
    I'll update once its in.
    79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy

    93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver

    99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.

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    EFI GearHead ! EagleMark's Avatar
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    I'd really like to know. I've not had issues with Bosch? But I usually only buy delco type stuff...

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
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    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
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    Yea, I always thought bosch was supposed to be some of the best out there. But I am seeing more and more people online downing their o2 sensors. I have been running bosh o2's on my YJ ever since I have had it. So I ordered a NTK o2 for it, thats what it came with from the factory. Also installed 2 new NTK o2's in my WJ as reccomended by people on a WJ forum I am on. Same thing, they downed bosch o2's.
    79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy

    93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver

    99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.

  10. #10
    EFI GearHead ! EagleMark's Avatar
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    Yeah but is that another internet rumor?

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
    -= =-

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    I think on thirdgen there is a thread about the Bosch, and there was even some data in the thread showing the response is different/worse than the Delco.

    I was running a Bosch on mine for maybe 10 years and didn't seem to have a problem with it. I pulled it simply to install the heated Delco AFS-74.
    "Frankentruck" is a "1985" K5, TPI 350 '165/6E (Vortec Heads, SDPC2000 base, roller cam, headers), 32 Spline SM465, 205 w/VSS, 10b/14SF, 3.42's and 33" tires. Soon to be boxed frame, '87 sheetmetal, and TPI w/ '727

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    Fuel Injected! kunsan1987's Avatar
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    i realize this is a bosch but for the price would this wideband be an option?

    http://www.amazon.com/AEM-30-2001-Bo...531354&sr=1-31

  13. #13
    EFI GearHead ! EagleMark's Avatar
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    That's just the sensor that goes on a controller, need the controller as well.

    1990 Chevy Suburban 5.7L Auto ECM 1227747 $42!
    1998 Chevy Silverado 5.7L Vortec 0411 Swap to RoadRunner!
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  14. #14
    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
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    The ac delco ASF74 is the o2 I ordered. Got a ship confirmation today, should be here tuesday.

    That wideband looks identical to the ones that came with my innovate MTX-L guages I have in my cherokee and just installed into my YJ.

    I am still running a bosch o2 in my YJ (been in there a year or two) I just installed my MTX-L in it last weekend and have been watching my AFR. I will kep an eye on it and see how it does, then I will swap in the brand new NTK sensor and see if it runs any different. The 4 wire o2 I have in my cherokee is actually the exact same one thats in my YJ. Its a 4 wire heated, and I could find the vehicle end connector at the junkyards in any early-mid 90's jeep. So I used one of those sensors just cause it was 4 wire, plug was easy to find, and I thought they were all the same.
    Last edited by JeepsAndGuns; 11-21-2012 at 04:43 PM.
    79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy

    93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver

    99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.

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    Fuel Injected! JeepsAndGuns's Avatar
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    Ok, got the o2 today. Just to confirm (since its different than the one I am running right now) it has two black wires and one blue. I am going to assume the two black ones are the heating element, and the blue is the signal. Correct?
    79 Jeep Cherokee, AMC 401, T-18 manual trans, hydroboost, 16197427 MPFI system---the toy

    93 Jeep YJ Wrangler, 4.0L, 5 speed, 8.8 rear, homebrew hub conversion and big brakes, hydroboost, 2.5in OME lift, 31x10.50's---the daily driver

    99 Jeep WJ Grand Cherokee limited, 4.0L, auto, 2wd, leather and power everything, 99% stock---the long distance highway ride.

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