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Thread: VE adjusting

  1. #1
    Electronic Ignition! dk249's Avatar
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    VE adjusting

    Missing log data for VE in 90 and 100 cells on a 7060 $85. Why?

  2. #2
    LT1 specialist steveo's Avatar
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    have you actually floored it? at wide open throttle your VE table should be near atmospheric pressure whatever that is. sea level is 'bout 100kpa and 1000m is 'bout 90kpa. if those numbers don't line up either your map sensor has an issue or you have a severe intake restriction causing vacuum at WOT

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    Electronic Ignition! dk249's Avatar
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    5280 Above Sea Level, Denver Area

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    Electronic Ignition! dk249's Avatar
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    Makes sense steveo, Thanks. So when adjusting those higher levels just use the smoothing tool?

  5. #5
    LT1 specialist steveo's Avatar
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    yep pretty much, or take a trip down the mountain and fill those cells in
    and google says "The atmospheric pressure in Denver, Colorado, is usually about 84.0 kPa."
    so without a turbo, thats as much pressure as your engine will see - the air is thin.

  6. #6
    Electronic Ignition! dk249's Avatar
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    Thought so, yea I've been doing the best I can by keeping the 90 and 100 cells as rich as I can without conflicting with the 70 and 80 cells. I'm getting there. Thanks again for the info!

  7. #7
    LT1 specialist steveo's Avatar
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    sure, not a bad approach. keep in mind 90-100kpa would be hit when totally flooring it or badly lugging it at sea level, so a bunch of extra fuel would be fine, but the slope of a correct VE table in that region can be really weird looking, so i bet you will get a bit of a surprise if/when you run this thing down the mountain and check your AFR.

    i live in a valley where i live at sea level but climb a mountain to get out, so everything i do is +/- 10kpa. i can tell you one thing - elevation and turbochargers are the best of friends. if your air is too thin, it's a snail shaped compensator for that. there's a reason piston planes pretty much all have turbos, you can just turn a knob and your engine suffers none of the effects of altitude.

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    Electronic Ignition! dk249's Avatar
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    Yes true on the turbochargers. I have a 2020 Ram 3500 with 6.7 diesel that outpulls my 93 k3500 chevy with ease. Now I'm having a problem getting the ve right at 20 and 25 kpa. no mater what I do to the adjustments they stay at around 120. Could it be a vacuum leak or altitude and temp? Didn't have this problem last summer. I did find how to disable DFCO finally with the right XDF. and I think the same with PE or WOT is what I see. So this is why I'm rechecking.

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    Electronic Ignition! dk249's Avatar
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    I finally ended up going to a place that had a dyno and they got the ve tables to get the most horsepower. Now trying to get the spark tables right. Found out that I set my initial timing 4 degrees after instead of before. I'm having a problem with getting any knock no matter how advanced I make it?? Checked the knock sensor and it works. I tapped the block next to the sensor and read knock counts for each tap that I made. I have aluminum heads, so I thought maybe that was muffling a knock on this 454? By Advancing so much there was a huge difference in how bad it ran. Any ideas?

  10. #10
    Electronic Ignition! dk249's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dk249 View Post
    I finally ended up going to a place that had a dyno and they got the ve tables to get the most horsepower. Now trying to get the spark tables right. Found out that I set my initial timing 4 degrees after instead of before. I'm having a problem with getting any knock no matter how advanced I make it?? Checked the knock sensor and it works. I tapped the block next to the sensor and read knock counts for each tap that I made. I have aluminum heads, so I thought maybe that was muffling a knock on this 454? By Advancing so much there was a huge difference in how bad it ran. Any ideas?
    Can't hear any knocking as well.

  11. #11
    LT1 specialist steveo's Avatar
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    is your knock filter or module appropriate for a 454?
    aluminum heads are usually noisier so usually more false knock from valvetrain etc but engine acoustics are a complex thing to say the least

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    Electronic Ignition! dk249's Avatar
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    The 454 is the original engine for the truck with org PCM. Doesn't look like any filter or module between sensor and PCM from diagram and when I tested the wire with a ohm tester, it tested good. Is there a filter or module in the PCM? I have tried two different knock sensors, the org and a new delphi. Sending the delphi back for a replacement to see if it was bad or not as sensitive as it should be. Does anybody make a more sensitive knock sensor? There is only two for this motor. One for automatic trans and one for manual. I'm thinking the manual one would be even less sensitive?

  13. #13
    LT1 specialist steveo's Avatar
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    maybe there's no knock
    were you monitoring the knock count or knock retard
    the knock retard may not increase if you are outside the operating range where knock retard occurs
    many factory calibrations don't retard spark from knock events when not under load

  14. #14
    Electronic Ignition! dk249's Avatar
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    I have been doing both load and off load at sometimes more than 45deg advanced at 1000 to 3000RPM and 50 or more above that and no counts or retard until I physically knock on the block close to the knock sensor. When I do that I will get counts and retard readings on monitor of up to 8deg which the parameter is set to. And yes maybe there's no knock, but how can that be possible?

  15. #15
    Electronic Ignition! dk249's Avatar
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    I have the new knock sensor and it is a little more sensitive. Did a test run and no knock counts Set the spark table to the same as last post and no knock but backfire through the carb so I quickly dropped timing back. The only time I can get the knock sensor to respond is when in park and rev it to 4000 rpm. So what is my next step in getting timing right for this cam, heads, TBI boarded out and compression increase?

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