95 16197427 PCM with 94 4l60e

So I currently have a 1227747 ecm controlling my 5.7l TBI 350 engine and have a 700r4 code MD8. The engine runs fine but I'm getting tired of issues cropping up with the 700r4. I'm pretty sure there is too much valve/servo bore wear, I'm also tired of improper TCC lockup and yearly adjusting the TV cable with a line pressure gauge. I want to move to a 4l60e and I have a non PWM 1994 4l60e, I also have the 16197427 BJYL PCM I want to swap in. Is there a way to remove the PWM stuff from the BJYL bin with TunerPro? I have a G1 moates adapter and can burn chips no problem but looking at the info:http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...Information-0D seems like all the 94 bins are actually for a 16196395 pcm checking on the BCC lookup. Does this mean there would be wire changes when using these bins? I'm thinking of using the BJLH bin.... Is there a 94 PCM that would be better than the 16197427?

By the way, this is for a Jeep wrangler v8 swap so the 94 transmission was chosen so I can re-use my shifter, adapter, and output shaft from my 700r4. The 95's had longer protruding shift selectors because of the neutral safety switch....

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Originally Posted by c5wagner

So I currently have a 1227747 ecm controlling my 5.7l TBI 350 engine and have a 700r4 code MD8. The engine runs fine but I'm getting tired of issues cropping up with the 700r4. I'm pretty sure there is too much valve/servo bore wear, I'm also tired of improper TCC lockup and yearly adjusting the TV cable with a line pressure gauge. I want to move to a 4l60e and I have a non PWM 1994 4l60e, I also have the 16197427 BJYL PCM I want to swap in. Is there a way to remove the PWM stuff from the BJYL bin with TunerPro? I have a G1 moates adapter and can burn chips no problem but looking at the info:http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...Information-0D seems like all the 94 bins are actually for a 16196395 pcm checking on the BCC lookup. Does this mean there would be wire changes when using these bins? I'm thinking of using the BJLH bin.... Is there a 94 PCM that would be better than the 16197427?

By the way, this is for a Jeep wrangler v8 swap so the 94 transmission was chosen so I can re-use my shifter, adapter, and output shaft from my 700r4. The 95's had longer protruding shift selectors because of the neutral safety switch....

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$E6 code will run on a 7427. Some of the ECMs lack hardware for the ISS sensor used on the 4L80E.

I've done a few 1227747 to 16197427 conversions, allowing a 4L60E to replace the 700R4. I'm thinking BFMF in the link posted above looks promising to use for the 5.7 TBI / 16197427 and 1994 4L60E.

Bluecat Transmission Table Software (see attached) is very helpful when tuning the 4L60E shift points: https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...Table-Software

dave w

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Originally Posted by dave w

I've done a few 1227747 to 16197427 conversions, allowing a 4L60E to replace the 700R4. I'm thinking BFMF in the link posted above looks promising to use for the 5.7 TBI / 16197427 and 1994 4L60E.

Bluecat Transmission Table Software (see attached) is very helpful when tuning the 4L60E shift points: https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...Table-Software

dave w

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Thank you so much! It is also good to know I can tune shift points with the 4l60e. Another reason I hate the 700r4 is the bad shift points because of my 4.88 gears and 35's. Always shifts way too early and at bad moments like crawling in 4wd low 1-2 shift when set to 1st gear. Even after messing with the governor weights since the TV cable has to be adjusted just right, it is still bad.....

Another thing I need to figure out is the VSS. I currently have a jags that run VSS that only puts out 2000 pulse per mile just enough for the 1227747 ecm. The 2 options I have found are http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.c...916/prd916.htm or a reluctor from https://jagsthatrun.com/products/par...ing-relocation. The reluctor ring seems like the better option because I wouldn't have to worry about low range vss issues for shifting

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Originally Posted by c5wagner

Another thing I need to figure out is the VSS. I currently have a jags that run VSS that only puts out 2000 pulse per mile just enough for the 1227747 ecm.

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The 16197427 can also use a 2000 pulse per mile VSS. Where is the JAGS VSS located?

dave w

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Originally Posted by dave w

The 16197427 can also use a 2000 pulse per mile VSS. Where is the JAGS VSS located?

dave w

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The Jags VSS is on my transfer case currently as I have a cable driven speedo. I thought I would have problems with being in 4wd low with it on my transfer case and I noticed the 16197427 has a second VSS input
Attachment 13897
I thought the f13 supposedly takes the 2000ppm, where the F12 takes?????? I'm also trying to get the 128,000 pulse per mile so I can also use the VSSB so I can get the cruise control figured out as well.

F13 is the vehicle speed input for the 16197427. Pin A10 is the vehicle speed input for the 1227747. If I remember correctly, one of the JAGS VSS wires (doesn't matter which one) goes to F13 and the other JAGS VSS wire goes to chassis ground.

If you decide to use a 40 pulses per driveshaft revolution trigger wheel, you will need a VSSB / DRAC which has outputs for both F12, F13, and a cruise output. 128,000 pulses is for Rear Wheel Anti-Lock (RWAL)

Additional links:

http://614streets.com/drac.html

https://ck5.com/forums/threads/drac-...oblems.318351/

dave w

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Originally Posted by dave w

F13 is the vehicle speed input for the 16197427. Pin A10 is the vehicle speed input for the 1227747. If I remember correctly, one of the JAGS VSS wires (doesn't matter which one) goes to F13 and the other JAGS VSS wire goes to chassis ground.

If you decide to use a 40 pulses per driveshaft revolution trigger wheel, you will need a VSSB / DRAC which has outputs for both F12, F13, and a cruise output. 128,000 pulses is for Rear Wheel Anti-Lock (RWAL)

Additional links:

http://614streets.com/drac.html

https://ck5.com/forums/threads/drac-...oblems.318351/

dave w

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From the16197427 wire Diagram, F13 is the the equivalent of A10 from the 1227747 that I have the current JAGs vss hooked up to. But the F12 pin on the 16197427 is labeled as transmission output speed from VSSB. I have both a few DRACs and VSSBs that I soldered dip switches in for my 95 k1500 and for friends, I thought the VSSB with the 14 pins is what I need.
Attachment 13899

Does the F8 pin on the 16197427 PCM labeled 4wd indicator correct the VSS when in 4low? If so, aside from cruise, I wouldn't need to worry about changing the VSS

I apologize if my previous posts were confusing. I sometimes get in a hurry to reply to a thread. There are two different VSS options, depending on which transmission being used.
1. If using a non electronic transmission like the TH350, TH400, 700R4, or manual transmission using the JAGs VSS without the VSSB / DRAC works fine.
2. If using an electronic transmission like the 4L60E or 4L80E, using a 40 tooth trigger wheel that provides 40 pulses per driveshaft revolution signal to a DRAC / VSSB without the JAG's VSS. It's a good plan to use the F12 input with an electronic transmission.

It might be possible to use the JAGs VSS with an electronic transmission? I used the 40 pulses per driveshaft revolution signal to a DRAC / VSSB when I did a 16197427 conversion with an electronic transmission.

I would use the 14 pin VSSB with a 1993 - 1995 electronic transmission 4L60E / 4L80E.

I'm not 100% sure what F8 really does, but the 16197427 will need an input to compensate for 4WD Low to shift the transmission correctly.

dave w

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Originally Posted by dave w

I apologize if my previous posts were confusing. I sometimes get in a hurry to reply to a thread. There are two different VSS options, depending on which transmission being used.
1. If using a non electronic transmission like the TH350, TH400, 700R4, or manual transmission using the JAGs VSS without the VSSB / DRAC works fine.
2. If using an electronic transmission like the 4L60E or 4L80E, using a 40 tooth trigger wheel that provides 40 pulses per driveshaft revolution signal to a DRAC / VSSB without the JAG's VSS. It's a good plan to use the F12 input with an electronic transmission.

It might be possible to use the JAGs VSS with an electronic transmission? I used the 40 pulses per driveshaft revolution signal to a DRAC / VSSB when I did a 16197427 conversion with an electronic transmission.

I would use the 14 pin VSSB with a 1993 - 1995 electronic transmission 4L60E / 4L80E.

I'm not 100% sure what F8 really does, but the 16197427 will need an input to compensate for 4WD Low to shift the transmission correctly.

dave w

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Thanks for all the help! Found out that the F8 is only for 95 bins for the 16197427 PCM. The F8 corrects VSS signal for stock low range (2.72:1) when in 4low. My transfer case out of a rubicon with 4:1 would cause problems anyway unless I could figure out on my own what specific code in the BIN controls this. The 16196395 bins/PCM don't use F8 pin. The F13 is Vehicle speed and the F12 is transmission output speed. For the 4l60e, they should be the same but can show different speeds for low range if using 2 separate sensors. For the 4l80e with it's own VSS on the output, the vehicle speed can be different than the 4l80e output speed sensor ie 4lo. This means I could maintain my current VSS for the vehicle speed and add a separate one for transmission output if I wanted.

Overall, looks like I'm decided on using the JagsTR 40 tooth reluctor ring and drilling and tapping the rear of the 4l60e for the VSS. With the sensor there, I won't have to worry about low range and bad shift points.

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My transfer case out of a rubicon with 4:1 would cause problems anyway unless I could figure out on my own what specific code in the BIN controls this.

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There's a constant in the .bin for transfer case low range. It's called 4WD Low Reduction Ratio. You'd have to spend time figuring out how the value is calculated.

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Originally Posted by 1project2many

There's a constant in the .bin for transfer case low range. It's called 4WD Low Reduction Ratio. You'd have to spend time figuring out how the value is calculated.

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I figured out how it is calculated since it is a ratio, found out a 4:1 low range is the limit for Low reduction ratio for the Bin. I have modified the $0D XDF Low Reduction Line with an explanation of what to do with different than stock ratios for anyone else needing this for the future.

Hmm... If you are certain that the maximum ratio is 4.00:1 then I could simplify the formula to show the correct ratio and no extra math will be needed. I will keep the t-case ratios in the comments and possibly add a few more T-case ratios as well.

Interesting stuff. I actually just bought a 94 truck with a blown 4L60E and have a friend with a free 95 4L60E. I was wondering if I could just turn all the TCC stuff off in the BIN and use the 95 trans in the 94 truck. Has anyone tried something similar?

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Originally Posted by woody80z28

Interesting stuff. I actually just bought a 94 truck with a blown 4L60E and have a friend with a free 95 4L60E. I was wondering if I could just turn all the TCC stuff off in the BIN and use the 95 trans in the 94 truck. Has anyone tried something similar?

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The 94 bin already has the PWM stuff disabled. Why not just use a 95 bin like the BJYL and add the extra wire to the 95 transmission from the PCM for the pwm stuff?

Yeah, I am a Geophysicist so math isn't the hard part, overthinking is. I started making it far more complicated than I needed to by actually finding out what the value meant and how it related to the other vss values then decided to assume the stock low ratio is 2.72 from a np241 and set it up as a ratio so 2.72(stock ratio)/43.539(default bin value)= (new low ratio)/new(bin value) cross multiplied then got a simple answer..... I got the same new bin values with both methods then decided to edit the XDF to show the easier way. Also tested it with my friends 95 with a 203/205 double. So individually, those values worked because 4:1 is the limit.

Here's what I setup in excel to get the values I did. Might make adding more easier.

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Originally Posted by c5wagner

The 94 bin already has the PWM stuff disabled. Why not just use a 95 bin like the BJYL and add the extra wire to the 95 transmission from the PCM for the pwm stuff?

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Ummm...sure! That would work, too. haha Is it really that easy? I'll look for more info on it.

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Originally Posted by woody80z28

Ummm...sure! That would work, too. haha Is it really that easy? I'll look for more info on it.

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I've become something of an expert looking into this stuff the past week. It really would be that simple of adding a wire and changing the BIN for a 95. The wire would need to be added to pin E11 and connected to U on the picture here
Attachment 13945

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Yeah, I am a Geophysicist so math isn't the hard part, overthinking is.

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lol. I fully understand how that can happen. The conversion is 1/16383.7735 * the value in the .bin. I have made the changes and have included ratios for several common T-cases in the parameter comments. This way you can enter the low range ratio directly.

Thanks for posting back with the info and spreadsheet.

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Originally Posted by 1project2many

The conversion is 1/16383.7735 * the value in the .bin. I have made the changes and have included ratios for several common T-cases in the parameter comments. This way you can enter the low range ratio directly.

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Good stuff, I tip my hat to you for simplifying it even further!