1990 pontiac sunbird garbage data

[otheym]

I have a 1990 pontiac sunbird with the 2.2 liter engine. I used both $70.ads and $135.ads, converted them both to adx and attempted to use tunerpro. All I got was garbage data jumping wildly all over the place. I tried with and without the 10k resistor and no luck. My setup works fine with my 1994 s10. I am using a usb to ALDL from my laptop. I attempted to contact Robert Saar but he has not answered my emails. Can anybody point me in the right direction?

[Six_Shooter]

2.2? It should have a 2.0L. IIRC in 1990 they only had the OHC version.

What's the ECM service number and the BCC?

[RobertISaar]

I've still got your 5 emails sitting in my inbox, but I've been about 2 months behind at work for about the past 3 months... I haven't been able to undertake anything that requires more than 5 minutes of attention for that time.

[otheym]

I am sure what those terms mean?

[otheym]

Ok, i thought maybe you had passed

[otheym]

what do those terms mean ?

[1project2many]

ECM = The engine computer.
BCC = three or four letter code from the chip in the ecm.
OHC = OverHead Cam
IIRC = If I Remember Correctly

[otheym]

ECM = The engine computer.
BCC = three or four letter code from the chip in the ecm.
OHC = OverHead Cam
IIRC = If I Remember Correctly

Can anyone answer the question I posed about the data coming back being garbage? I am using the definition file that Bob Saar gave me for that car and the data I get jumps around all over the place. Is it the serial interface not syncing up with the ECM correctly? I tried it with the 10K resistor an it made no difference. If none of this works is there a scan tool that would work with this car? I need to troubleshoot it.

[1project2many]

Yes, we can answer the question. Please provide the BCC and ecm number so we can confirm that you are using the correct files. Pontiac didn't equip their cars with 2.2l engines in the US in 1990 so we want to start from the beginning.

[otheym]

[QUOTE=1project2many;55985]Yes, we can answer the question. Please provide the BCC and ecm number so we can confirm that you are using the correct files. Pontiac didn't equip their cars with 2.2l engines in the US in 1990 so we want to start from the beginning.
The ecm is 1227748. How do I retrieve the bcc number?

[otheym]

[QUOTE=1project2many;55985]Yes, we can answer the question. Please provide the BCC and ecm number so we can confirm that you are using the correct files. Pontiac didn't equip their cars with 2.2l engines in the US in 1990 so we want to start from the beginning.
The ecm is napa part number xtp652. How do I retrieve the bcc number?My son reminded me that we changed the ecm 3 years ago. I looked at the old one and it is a 1228321.

[1project2many]

1227748 was not used in the Sunbird. It is from 1987 and used with a 2.5 liter engine.

The 1228321 is from a 90 Sunbird. It is used with 2.0L and 2.2L engines. The BCC is a three or four letter code and may be on a sticker on the ecm.

There are several different datastreams for 2.0l and 2.2l engines. Is your car TBI?

[otheym]

yes, it is tbi non turbo.The original ecm says on it service no. 1228321 atwb. I think that would be the bcc. I can put the original back in if that will help. I put the new one from napa in and swapped proms. The car works ok but has a starting problem when hot which was why I changed ecms. That was before I knew very much. What would you suggest I do now?
I have looked on the internet for definition files but have not been able to find any.

[otheym]

I have not been able to find any definition files for that car. I just need an ads or adx file as I am not going to do any reprogramming of the chip. Do you have any?

[Six_Shooter]

If you can provide the Service number and BCC of the ECM and PROM that is in the car we can help you find the correct files, until then we can't.

[otheym]

1228321 atwb

[otheym]

why isn't anyone responding to my post? I have supplied all of the information asked for.

[1project2many]

I'm sorry no one has solved this problem for you. We are often busy during the day.

I do not know which file goes with your car. The calibration you listed is for a 2.0 liter engine and belongs with a 1227748 ecm. That engine is an overhead cam engine and uses a distributor.

ECM 1228321, belongs with Chevrolet 2.0l TBI engines used in 1987, 1988, and 1989. These engines did not have a distributor and were cam - in - block.

The ecm + calibration + engine combination are invalid. Calibrations for one ecm usually don't work as expected in a different ecm. A calibration for a distributor engine won't work with distributorless ignition and the distributorless calibration won't work with the distributor engine.

If you wish to work on this mystery without waiting for answers, here are the links I used:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_122_engine#LL8
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_II_engine#LT2
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pontiac_Sunbird

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1-OOBoFA5mNSGgyV2xCTmZGc0k/edit?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1-OOBoFA5mNeWZxbW1kdDQ0dTQ/edit?usp=sharing

http://www.gearhead-efi.com/gearhead-efi/def/aldl/INDEX.DOC
http://www.gearhead-efi.com/gearhead-efi/def/aldl/

[RobertISaar]

here's a test ADX for the 1228321 ECM.

[otheym]

The ECM i have in there right now is a 1227748. I tried a couple of definition files including $135 which Bob Saar gave me. The car runs fine with that ecm but I just can't read any reliable data from it with Tunerpro. Is that the correct definition file? I hope you can answer this question for me as I am ready to give up on tunerpro and buy a scan tool.

[1project2many]

First, there aren't too many people working with your engine and ecm so keep in mind that we may be making best guesses for you. Tunerpro is cheap but the tradeoff is that we have to figure it out on our own sometimes.

Second, don't mix and match ecm's and chips. Keep ATWB with the 1227748. Keep the 1228321 with its calibration.

There are four definition files listed for a 2.0 TBI Sunbird engine. A135 is for a 1990 and 1991 Sunbird. ATWB is for a 1227748 in a 1990 Sunbird. So on paper everything will work if its kept together.

If you are mixing and matching chips then you will get garbage. If you plug in an expensive scan tool it will provide you with expensive garbage. If you use Tunerpro you will get your garbage for free. If you are thinking a scantool will work better, maybe you should talk with a garage or a mechanic who has a tool to see if they can just hook up to your car and try to talk with it? It could save you money.

[otheym]

OK, thanks. Looks like I need to learn a few things before I ask any more questions. I have a background working on aircraft computer control systems but this is somewhat different.

[f85gtron]

He's saying keep the right os with the hardware....like Mac os with Mac , Windows for pc...., so you have to keep the original chip info structure. Keep asking questions because it helps everyone learn.

[otheym]

from what I have seen studying the schematics the ecm is a 16 bit computer chip with the program and data tables stored in a 2732 eprom. Of course the prom has to match the application exactly, the application being the engine being controlled. I spent many hours loading eproms with firmware for jet engine controllers. I just need to learn the acronyms and what they mean. The concepts seem to be the same. Finding the right definition file has been a challange to say the least. I didn't have any trouble finding one for my 94 s10 and tunerpro works very well on it.

[Six_Shooter]

from what I have seen studying the schematics the ecm is a 16 bit computer chip with the program and data tables stored in a 2732 eprom. Of course the prom has to match the application exactly, the application being the engine being controlled. I spent many hours loading eproms with firmware for jet engine controllers. I just need to learn the acronyms and what they mean. The concepts seem to be the same. Finding the right definition file has been a challange to say the least. I didn't have any trouble finding one for my 94 s10 and tunerpro works very well on it.

Partially correct. Yes it's a 16 bit microcrontroller, but not ALL of the instructions are contained on the EPROM in every case, this is especially true with the C3 style ECM (usually a 24 pin EPROM), where only part of the instruction set is on the removable EPROM and the rest is hard-coded into the ECM.

It's best to use the service number that originally matched that BCC. There are cases where MEMCALS (that contain the EPROM) can be swapped between different service numbers, but you're not at a point where you can claim that with any real certainty, and this is a rare ability for a C3 style ECM. I'm not aware of any edge card connector ECMs with this ability.

So the EPROM has to match more than just the engine it's running it also has to match the ECM, which is why it's important to know what that is along with the BCC.

Until you get these things to match you'll likely get nothing but garbage data, and I'm surprised you get any data at all. Usually the ECM will throw a code 51 and go into LHM (Limp Home Mode), when the wrong EPROM is installed.

[otheym]

The next step for me will be to pull the ecm out of the car and see exactly what I have. It is winter and the car is outside so it might be a while. I was looking at the headers on the files I have and what does StrvVinCode mean?

[Six_Shooter]

No idea, I've never come across StrvVinCode before.

What is it in reference to? Or what is the context of where you've come across that?

[otheym]

it is part of an ads definition file. Seems to be in every one. Just curious.