Base Tune or close to spec tune for 0411 SBC406AFR-HSR

[evilstuie]

Hi Guys,

I seem to have backed myself into a bit of a corner by not doing enough research and trying to find the cheapest route to tuning.
I went and bought an AVT-852 cable thinking I could use it with a copy of EFI Live I had with a demo serial that allows editing and saving etc, but was sadly mistaken.

Since then I've found I can use TunerPro and LS1 Flashtool in conjunction with Dimented's XDF files etc to edit, save and flash .BIN files to the PCM, hooray!

But I'm still out of my depth. I actually built the motor trying to mirror a lot of the common builds on thirdgen.org in hopes I could find a tune file that matches mine close enough to upload and drive until I can afford to take the car to a tuning shop, but haven't been able to find anyone with access to their own tune in .bin format.

If anyone can point me towards a better .BIN file to use as a base, or has a .BIN file that is close to my specs I'd be very appreciative, or even point me in the direction of a good mail order tune place, or even better, a tutorial or guide to tuning using the TunerPro OBD2 software:)



406 SBC
approx. 10.5:1 Compression
XE270HR Cam (12-422-8)
AFR 195 comp heads, heavily ported 64cc
HSR Intake with 58mm Arizona Speed Marine Throttle body
30lb/hr injectors
Vortec dizzy
x24 OBD2 setup
0411 PCM (from 2001 Holden Commodore VX Calais LS1)
4L60E transmission
2.77 9-bolt rear

VATS Disabled
Engine Cylinder displacement adjusted
http://i765.photobucket.com/albums/xx293/evilstuie/current%20settings.jpg (http://s765.photobucket.com/user/evilstuie/media/current%20settings.jpg.html)
Also not sure what do to here for the firing order change from LS1 to SBC, why is channel 01 =15?, and how do you change the bank order?

[evilstuie]

Anyone?

[dave w]

I've been away from the board lately.

I opened the the above .bin in my EFI Live software. I see you are using OS 12225074.

I noticed you are using a 24x CKP sensor. So am I correct you are using a per-coil ignition system?

I have a similar project, 406 SBC 4x CKP with a Vortec distributor. I'm using OS 12212156 from a 2002 Express Van.

I have the ability to Flash an '0411 PCM with EFI Live .ctz files and then read back the Flashed .ctz file as a .bin file.

Maybe you could post a modified EFI Live .ctz file you have setup for the 406 SBC, then I can post a .bin file you can flash?

I am unable to help you with TunerPro OBD II tuning.

dave w

[evilstuie]

I've been away from the board lately.

I opened the the above .bin in my EFI Live software. I see you are using OS 12225074.

I noticed you are using a 24x CKP sensor. So am I correct you are using a per-coil ignition system?

I have a similar project, 406 SBC 4x CKP with a Vortec distributor. I'm using OS 12212156 from a 2002 Express Van.

I have the ability to Flash an '0411 PCM with EFI Live .ctz files and then read back the Flashed .ctz file as a .bin file.

Maybe you could post a modified EFI Live .ctz file you have setup for the 406 SBC, then I can post a .bin file you can flash?

I am unable to help you with TunerPro OBD II tuning.

dave w

Hi Dave,

Sorry I didn't get a reply notification and was checking through old posts.

That would be great if you could.
I'll try to upload it tonight.
I think if I can get the fuel and spark tables from your 406 express tune, and put them over the VX LS1 values it'd be a good starting point.

[dave w]

I think if I can get the fuel and spark tables from your 406 express tune, and put them over the VX LS1 values it'd be a good starting point.

I think it might be a good plan to use a base LQ4 / LQ9 6.0 24x tune to start with. I recently worked with a SBC 5.7 24x system, which I modified a 5.3 24x flash to start with.

dave w

[evilstuie]

I think it might be a good plan to use a base LQ4 / LQ9 6.0 24x tune to start with. I recently worked with a SBC 5.7 24x system, which I modified a 5.3 24x flash to start with.

dave w

Oh ok, I'll have a look after work and see if I can find one on crazyholden.com or something.
Cheers.

[dave w]

Can you use a different OS? I think you are using OS 12225074?

I have some 6.0 Liter 24x files, mostly OS 12212156.

dave w

[delcowizzid]

you also cant change the firing order in the software you must wire the firing order to suit.the settings above are for narrowband fueling with twin O2's and diaagnostics purposes

[evilstuie]

Can you use a different OS? I think you are using OS 12225074?

I have some 6.0 Liter 24x files, mostly OS 12212156.

dave w

I haven't looked into the OS flash yet, but I think the Dimented flash tool allows for this yes?
Does the .Bin file include the OS or can i get that from somewhere else to run?
I'm not 100% sure what the OS is on the PCM until I download it and see.

I've got 2xo2 sensors and the harness has been repinned to suit the SBC firing order.

[dave w]

The attached .bin is from my daily driver 1999 S-10 pickup, which has a mostly stock 5.7 liter L31 / 24x / NV3500 power train. :thumbsup:

dave w

[1project2many]

Very gracious of you.

[LRT]

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[dave w]

I'm using the 24x crankshaft trigger wheel, 1x Vortec distributor camshaft setup, with 8 individual LSx coils. dave w

[Hog]

I have been reading your posts regarding this project (in several threads) trying to come up with a low cost solution.

I just noticed something ... you using a 24x CKP reluctor on the SBC, and using a Vortec distributor for the 1x CMP signal ... are you using 8 LS style coils for spark distribution, or the Vortec distributor (with 8 spark plug wires) ?

I don't know for certain, but I had thought that to use a Vortec distributor to fire the cylinders, you had to use the Vortec 4x CKP system, and if you switched to a 24x CKP system you then had to use the coil-per-cylinder system (8 LS coils) to fire the cylinders.

Maybe someone else knows the answer to this ...
You are correct, in order to use the distributer to actually deliver the spark energy, you must use a 4x CKP reluctor and the distributers 1x signal along with the calibration file from a 2001-2002 van that had the L31 350 engine and 0411 PCM.

To actually run CNP you use the 24 CKP reluctor, Vortec distributer for the 1x CMP signal. For cable throttle, use a Camaro LS1 calibration in the 512kb calibration, for ETC(Electronic Throttle Control) use a Corvette calibration in the 512kb PCM.

peace
Hog

[evilstuie]

Yeah sorry, I'm using the 8 LS1 coil pack setup, vortec distributor is just for cam position.

[LRT]

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[evilstuie]

Thanks so much for that!!!
I'm in Melbourne for another 2 days, but I know most of the details.
No MAF
Return style rail
One knock sensor on left side of motor, TPI 350 style
Trans - no gear selector mounted
Dual fans, but wired for single trigger, 180F thermostat
Injectors from memory are 28lbs LS1 injectors
As soon as I'm back I can get the numbers off the injectors.
Thanks so much for this :)

[evilstuie]

Hey LRT, The injectors are 28lbs LS1 injectors - part# 12561462Let me know if you need any other info :)

[LRT]

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[evilstuie]

Yes, set to 58psi, with the vacuum attached and 2.77 gears.

[LRT]

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[evilstuie]

Awesome! Thanks so much for this :)

[LRT]

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[LRT]

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[evilstuie]

Hey LRT,Its a lot better than before! :)
It idles a bit rough, but without any throttle which is awesome.
I still need to give it a little throttle on ignition, so maybe a little more cranking air as you mentioned.
The scanner rpm doesn't match the gauges, but i can calibrate the gauges later when I get the software.I had enough time to check the alternator is working correctly 14.4V output, and to see that my thermo fans are not triggering properly.
What pin on the PCM outputs the signal to the relay? and is it 12v or GND trigger?
The temp got to 102C before I turned it off. I'm also running 8qt of oil in there for run in, so i could really rev it past 2000, but so far so good.
Cheers,
Stu

[evilstuie]

Oh, and there's a P0102 code

[LRT]

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[evilstuie]

This one starts easier but doesn't idle on its own.It always takes me 2 attempts to start it so i think i have the distributor on TDC intake instead of exhaust, but second attempt starts almost instantly so cranking settings seem to be good.

[LRT]

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[evilstuie]

Hey mate,
Sorry for the delay getting back to you, new years wiped me out for a day.
This one is much better, I also found it helps to have PIN42 on the harness to trigger the thermo fans. I think the commodores use the bcm to trigger the fans maybe.
The idle was much better, it feels a bit rough, but maybe that's the cam, I have no point of refernece, but it was sitting between 620-750rpm without feeling like it was going to cut out which is good, and with the harness pinned with a wire at Blue-42 it triggered at 89.5C so all is looking good.
I've got a bit of smoke coming from the engine I have to investigate and see whether its just oil sputting out the breather because there's too much, or a small leak somewhere, but I think with this tune it's good enough to fault-find and run the motor in properly to take another oil sample and make sure everything's good with it before either taking to the tuning shop, or giving COS1 a go :)
Are you able to post the COS1 when you have the time and I can start learning the tuning process with TunerPro while I wait for the chip adapters to get here :)
Thanks again so much for your help, it's a fantastic feeling to be able to just sit in the car and idle :)
This is the car by the way:
http://i765.photobucket.com/albums/xx293/evilstuie/temporary_225.jpg (http://s765.photobucket.com/user/evilstuie/media/temporary_225.jpg.html)

[evilstuie]

https://youtu.be/08F3poNtivo
http://i765.photobucket.com/albums/xx293/evilstuie/temporary_98.jpg (http://s765.photobucket.com/user/evilstuie/media/temporary_98.jpg.html)

[LRT]

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[evilstuie]

Good job sorting out the fans. The idle speed per the BIN that you are using, should be 800 - 850 RPM at operating temperature (not 620 - 750 RPM); a higher idle speed will help to reduce the "roughness" that the tight camshaft lobe separation angle will cause.You have an AVT cable, Yes ?Do you want to try logging some data using TunerPro to help sort out the idle ? I could provide you with an ADX scanner file to use, and instructions on how to record live data.
Yeah, sure, thanks.
I'll set up the car pc this afternoon so we can log, and I'll drain some of the excess out just to see if it makes an immediate difference.

[evilstuie]

Yeah, sure, thanks.I'll set up the car pc this afternoon so we can log, and I'll drain some of the excess out just to see if it makes an immediate difference.Hey LRT, Work has been a bit full on so I haven't had a chance to touch the car yet, but on the weekend I'll do some logging and drain some of the oil.

[LRT]

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[evilstuie]

Hey LRT,
I got the flash chip adaptor, so I'm good to go with the COS1 tune if you have a copy?
I was going to get the roadworthy done on the car tomorrow but yesterday afternoon I revved the car to just over 4000rpm to see how it goes and oil started pissing out the front somewhere, I'm guessing either the timing cover crankshaft seal, or the bottom of the timing cover, but it's put a plug in my plans to get it on the road.
I'm going to have a proper look tomorrow and see what's going on, but if I have to pull the motor to fix it, I'll have a bit of time on my hands to kill with the rebuild so I can use the extra time to learn about the tuning and see what I can DIY before giving the tuners a shot.
I put the broke .BIN in the other thread in case you wanted to have a look. And I'm still not sure on what/how to byte swap the bin for direct flashing.

[LRT]

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[evilstuie]

I had started working on the COS 1, but then switched over to trying to get the ADX to work correctly for data logging. Will get back on the COS 1.Regarding the oil leak ....What timing cover are you using ?The original SBC and the later "Vortec" version have slightly different timing cover mounting surfaces. If you are trying to use an OEM plastic Vortec timing cover on an original SBC, it will leak (unless you also use about a pound of silicone sealer !).EFI Connection offers a modified OEM plastic cover for use with a SBC (that should not leak).I'm using the EFI connection one on a 400SBC block. We put a fairly liberal amount of RTV sealer on it, but it may have just been a bit too much oil in the pan and pressure blew it out.I'll tool around with the program and see what I can find. I'm still deciding if it would be a better idea to put a SOP socket on the PCM instead of soldering the flash chip back on, but I suppose once the COS1 is on there I can reflash the tune with the Flash tool so long as the OS stays the same.Did you have just a stock COS1 or any COS1 BIN file I can use to load onto the chip and see if I get the PCM working again, then we can flash the tune on when you get the time to work on it?

[LRT]

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[evilstuie]

Ah ok, no problems. I've got plenty to keep me busy int he meantime haha.Thanks again for all your help with this.

[punisher454]

Would either the COS1 or COS3 bins be usable with a 2088 XDF in tunerpro? I have a few car projects that would be real nice to have running on 0411 pcm's. One can run a MAF, the other 2 I'd prefer SD and one of them will be running a 2-Bar MAP. The boosted car runs a 4l80E, the other SD car runs a 4l60E and the MAF car runs a 700R4. I'd like to just use 1 XDF for everything.

So far all my searching has only turned up 2 usable XDF's for 0411 PCM's and nothing for the 1MB p59's yet.

[LRT]

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[TilmanNA]

SUPER DAVE!!! Hello!! I'm looking for a .bin such as the 1999 daily you spoke of, yet I'm unable to locate that .bin. that seems like the 'Seg-swap' for my set up. pretty close to what I have, yet mine is all stock. THANKS!!!!

[dave w]

4x crank trigger?

dave w

[TilmanNA]

Dave!! Hello!! Its a plain jane 2002 express van L31 and I am ashamed to say I do not know right off hand. I will look and find out. Thanks for the response. brb...

[TilmanNA]

Hey Dave. yes 4x trigger. had to do some reading and comaring of pics to make for sure, ashamed I did not know right off hand...

[dave w]

This gearhead-efi link has 2002 Express Van .bin files: http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Injection/showthread.php?1513-2002-TunerPro-Bin-Files

dave w

[TilmanNA]

Awesomeness! Thanks!!