DA Data Errors?

[xtreamvette69]

i'm using tuner pro rt v.5 .. car is 85 corvette that has been converted to running the 165 ecm.

anyhow first off what are these errors and what causes them? i am assuming they pop up when for a split second the data isnt flowing and in a split sec it resumes its connection. but what causes this? or is it common? i read a few probs with the 165 ecm's and logging..

could this be a grounding quirk with the ecm or a power querk with the ecm? nothing leads me to belive either of those are an issue really but its possible because after further testing(only tested this far once so could just have been coincadense but i dont think so) anyhow the errors seem to get more frequent as the engine gets up to operating temp and even more frequent as it climbs a bit hot and at about 217-220*F tuner pro just stopped renewing data and just sat saying connecting... any ideas? if not i still would like to know what causes the few randome ones as well.....

also should not this was all durring a recorded log, i dont know if that makes a diff or not in amount of errors or not but figured i would mention it.

[delcowizzid]

are the errors regular on off on off on off and data jumping around or just the odd error and data looks good.if its continous on off on check the adx aldl echo setting.if its not echo problems you may have to edit the time delays in the adx

[xtreamvette69]

it starts out as just very very few random errors, data looks good, only sign thats noticable with the errors is just the red error blink... but as i said not many and random .

as it gets toward operating temp though the error is almost a blink on..off..on..off. pretty consistant pattern then as engine gets warmer the eror just turns into connecting message, no data changes.

[delcowizzid]

what adx are you using for logging link it up

[xtreamvette69]

using arap bin, $6E def file and 1227165_6E.adx

[xtreamvette69]

hmm ok so i'm still having this issue or having it again or got worse or something but it is a lil differant now that i edited the adx file to get rid of the DA data errors...i have read through many of the issue threads here as well as all around the net and most of what i see is problems getting it to work(initial connection) but no probs after that.

oh also failed to mention i am using the moates cable ('ALDU1 and CABL1' (http://www.moates.net/aldu1-and-cabl1-p-127.html?cPath=64))pricey lil bugger, sorry mark i didnt know there were any avalible on this site.. and cheaper too..
kinda thinking maybe sendin an email to moates about this see if he has any ideas, because for that much money for a cable i should deserve a lil support lol.

now what it is doing is working great, may take up to 20 tries showing data error till it connects(that speed has progressivly gotten worse it seems from what it use to be).

anyhow once connected works great was logging for many mins at a time(probably 5mins - 10mins no issues, but lately it is more like just a few mins(about the time it takes to get from cold to 170* sometimes almost 200* then bam..bombardment of red flash data errors, data doesnt update, if recording log it quits recording and it never recovers the connection.
click disconnect then reconnect = red flashy data errors, no connect.
close tunerpro then open it= red flashy data errors, no connect.
key off 20-40 seconds then on(read post talking bout this by moates someplace)= red flashy errors
even reboot pc doesnt always cure it, almost like its a time delay or temp that needs to cool off issue.

so to recap.. for a while after fixing errors with by editing ADX files with a pause/silance also fixed one with the adding 1 trick= all was well, never lost connection or had any problems. it was always me stopping the recordings not tunerpro having errors.
now after random length of time(usually less then a few mins) TP just starts erroring out (constant flash of error/connecting just like unplugging it) also same end result as unplugging it.
cant reconnect till it wants me to it seems, have tried a few ways.

any ideas? its back to almost being unusable again or at least not efficiant to run a recorded log session only to find that TP stopped responding long before you were done, so you have to do it all over again.

[EagleMark]

I've been reading stories like that with $6E data for years....

[xtreamvette69]

:sad: thats not helping and not what i want to hear.
why so random though, for days perfectly behaved then bam, nothing but troubles?
why do some never have problems? seems unlikely that the ecm's are just flakey on diff levels and random times.. must be some sorta trigger although i dont see odd behaviour on logs before it happens... i just feel i'm missing something here.

oh and did i mention this is a new rebuilt ecm as well.

i'm getting ohh soooo close to just getting a megasquirt and being done with this other factory stuff. not really but have been thinking strongly about it.

[RobertISaar]

i don't think it is a 6E issue so much as the 7165 in general. some are just really flakey when it comes to comms.

[delcowizzid]

does it only happen with 6E or all code bases.are the sensor grounds and ecu grounds earthed seperate and do you have hard drive protection on your laptop it can cause logging issues when it stops the HD spinning when you bump your laptop causing log issues

[xtreamvette69]

RobertIsaar][/COLOR] i don't think it is a 6E issue so much as the 7165 in general. some are just really flakey when it comes to comms.
behaves same as it did with the old other ecm. but why was it doing so good then with no changes now so bad? why so random and yet consistant?i can connect and disconnect from it indefinatly without issues probablyforever but once log/record a while it wont let me connect no matter what i try till its ready. think more or less delay(listen for silance would help?) oh and i just checked and saw that moates just updated his driver install exe, think it was updated for a reason or just because the chip manufacturer has new drivers up?


does it only happen with 6E or all code bases.are the sensor grounds and ecu grounds earthed seperate and do you have hard drive protection on your laptop it can cause logging issues when it stops the HD spinning when you bump your laptop causing log issues
not sure about anything else except the 6E as thats all i've used it for l8ly, it did log the old 870 ecm fine without issues. but then again it was logging the 165ecm without issues as well.

as for grounds, the harness has only been repinned to the 165 ecm so grounds are same as the would be on a 86 vette, i have checked them and cleaned them as well as added more.. like i said all problems seemed gone and all was working great then it just started this behaviour all over again.


i do have HD protection on this lappy and it is on but wasnt giving any issues just before this and doubt its activating as it will data error jus setting still in ideling car on the seat(guess next try i should watch to make sure the HDD protection doesnt activate but doubting it does)

like i said though, the oddest part about it even though random seems to be that it only does it once car is warmed up.. usually 170*-200* then doesnt want to reconnect till some time passes or car cools some. might be coincadence but seems odd.

also as i said logs dont seem to show any odd voltage etc before it happens unless im overlooking it. reason i say unless i'm overlooking it is because one of the last times it happened i noticed something i thought odd(my oil pressure gauge on dash usually displays 80# at idle or close, sometimes dropping to 79 but the last time TP errored out my gauge dropped to 55 just before or as it started erroring) i really should investigate that gauge sending unit and wiring though anyhow because setting at 80 always at idle jus seems odd as well.

also TP is in record mode when this happens, could that be important? i should hook to and log it just with key on engine off, log and record key on engine off, log running, log and record running.. just to try and nerrow down and or eliminate possibilities, think that would be a good idea?

[xtreamvette69]

ok did further testing and these are my findings on what i checked, idk if any help or not.. i just dont know what else to check.
i checked and will add that FTDI is on com 4 and driver ver is 2.8.24.0

---cold engine (hasnt been run in past 24hrs)
---key on engine off took 37 errors to finally connect.
---connected and logging/recording @ 3:25pm, TP is running at 8:21-9:86HZ
---at 3:35pm i activate HDD protection by shaking pc=no errors or problems.
---at 3:38pm the ecm case and chip are at 79*f
---at 3:40pm i start the engine TP still logging and still recording.(no new errors)
---at 3:58pm engine is now up to 203*f and fan has kicked on. (no new errors)
---at 3:59pm just almost exactly as fan kicks off (errors begin flashing and no connect) ecm case temp is @ 90*f and chip is @91*f...........................
.................................................. ...............................................
---after trying everything such as shut down TP then restart=nothing
---key off wait/ key on= nothing
---disconnect everything/ reconnect=nothing
---blow on ecm/chip
---4:08pm finally try to connect after blowing on ecm/chip ecm is 77* and chip is 78* car 197*f i get 16 errors then a connect. (ecm and chip temps coincedence?)
---4:12pm i start car still logging but no record
---4:16pm i get just one data error glitch
---4:17pm constant errors and not able to log or connect again... ecm case was only up to 84-85.5*f and chip was 93*f-96*f
---------------this was the end of my testing-----------------
all testing was done under the mild conditions of just setting and idling.
also keep in mind that it is an infered temp gun and being closer or further away and angle effect it some, so temp may not all be exact but close.

another test i did When TP lost connection and wouldnt connect besides trying the handheld, i also tried to jump A&B terminals ALDL and that was working perfectly..fan came on and started flashing the all ok code 12.

[delcowizzid]

burn a different code onto an eprom even if it doesnt suit the car and swap codes once upto temp and see if you can connect

[EagleMark]

That would see if it was the mask... so maybe $32?

But as Robert said he does not beleive it is $6E and it is ECM, when I said I've been reading those stories for years it just happens to be $6E, but your temp testing is sure pointing at a ECM issue!

Some guys with that ECM have no issue...

[RobertISaar]

32, 32B and 6E, i've seen all of them do it to some degree. i really have no idea why either. it's one of the reasons i've shied away from anything 7165 powered.

[delcowizzid]

try $12p in it and see if it logs will clear any doubt of the ecu it has pretty solid comms.if the issue is still there ide be looking at an earth wire going high resistance when hot or something

[EagleMark]

Yeah but this is normal behavior for so many I've only read about, never had my hands on one.

But I do wonder and Robert may know... is this more prevalent to Corvettes then camaros or? What I'm thinking is fiberglass body and noise? GM went through a lot of trouble to cover distributor and ignition wires back then...

[RobertISaar]

i think i've seen it equally in both.... but it has been a while since i've looked into it.

i would think if it were that, then the 7727 equipped corvettes from 90-91(and the ZR1 as well) would have the same problem, since those are also underhood(and i assume in a similar location). those.... it's just dataline chatter that trips up datalogging.

[xtreamvette69]

delcowizzid...never heard of a $12p but i will look and try one if i can to see if that helps.
and yes i was thinking ground issue once hot too thats why i cleaned all the frame,engine,and ecm grounds and added extra(might still add more idk yet.

EagleMark.. yes i have seen a few stories about the 165's as well but there are equil or more stories that people have no pproblems which leads me to belive this is a fixable problem just that nobody has bothered looking into thouroghly yet...yet!!
tbh i would think the thick fiberglass would help insulate and isolate against electrical noise moreso then a steel body but i guess depends what type of electrical noise your trying to shield against.

RobertIsaar....it is true that the later corvettes you speak of have the ecm underhood but the early portion of the c4 corvetts 84-89 all had the ecm inside the car located under the dash.

i do however belive that it could be associated with some sort of engine noise though because i think it errors faster when revving etc rather then just idle, but i will have to further test that because it may be that it just heats things up faster.
another test i'm planning will be to remove the ecm case again and add thermal past to the contact areas of heatsinks to case as well as add fan cooling for testing purposes.. i will get to the bottom of this or hopefully at least get an answer as to why... just seems odd that in shop enviroments i have never had troubles or heard of troubles having shop scanners (handhelds and oem scanners) hook to and communicate with any.. and before you ask if handheld can connect when TP cant, the answer is nope, although my handheld is far from oem gm scanner equipment or pro.

but any and all possibilities, ideas and things to test are welcome to try and help me solve this as i dont really want to have to liquidate all my equipment to buy a megasquirt as i wanted to wait and buy one of those after some experiance for my HSR stroker.

oh and i forget to mention another test i did When TP lost connection and wouldnt connect besides trying the handheld, i also tried to jump A&B terminals ALDL and that was working perfectly..fan came on and started flashing the all ok code 12. dont know if that means anything but just more info..

at all times when checked tunerpro says the cable is found and functional.. when unhooked from vehicle of course.

[xtreamvette69]

oh also....is there a reason that my cable when switched to the 10k position doesnt change the way the car runs(idle or anything) switching between open and 10k makes no differance. i do switch it to 10k to hook up then sometimes switch it to open and other times i dont bother and just leave it in the 10k mode and everything is the same.

i was under the impression that the 165 would be like the 870 in the respect that when in 10k car would run differantly?

anyone familier with the 165 and the 10k vs open position to verify this?

[RobertISaar]

with the 7165 and any other P4 unit that needs a 10K to start a connection(i don't think there are many), those generally don't add spark and modify idle speed when in ALDL mode. it's the C3s that you have to watch out for.

[Six_Shooter]

Yeah but this is normal behavior for so many I've only read about, never had my hands on one.

But I do wonder and Robert may know... is this more prevalent to Corvettes then camaros or? What I'm thinking is fiberglass body and noise? GM went through a lot of trouble to cover distributor and ignition wires back then...


The issue is that the only code that most of us are familiar with, that is used in the '7165, are $32, $32B and $6E. It could very well be possible that the code itself has connectivity issues.

As an example, I use the '7730/'7749 and have used different codes in them. Looking at my car directly. I have used $59 for years, without issue, quick connectivity and quite solid. There are a few data errors every now and then, but very few. I recently swapped to $58 for some testing and found that at times it takes longer to connect, and data errors are far more frequent. There is a patch that is said to get rid of this (and allow use of an AutoProm), that I haven't tried on my car yet, but have on another car it worked the way it was described. so that points to a code issue.

I will be testing $12P soon, since I am mostly done with the adapter harness.

[xtreamvette69]

all good info and true but i know there is a cause and with having a cause means there has to be a fix..maybe not a practical fix but a fix non the less lol

now onto my updates:
i have tried the following..
---lappy plugged in (not on batt power)
---cooling fan on ecm and chip keeping it all at 80*
---added battery charger onto the car
--- also worth noting was that the car disconnected from error at about the same time and same engine operating temp as before still, so seems that parts still pretty consistant at least in my case.
all these still = the same end result of the errors and ending of connection
now i did test the key off process before and it didnt work to restore connection but figured i would be more systematic this time.
this time i stopped connection on TP, unplugged from ALDL, shut key off, waited at least 20-30 seconds, turned key on, started TP to connecting, then plugged into the ALDL and connection success consistantly all 4 times that i had the disconnect.

that is all the testing i have done today but will do more later...

keep the ideas and possibilities coming, i will get around to testing them all soon as possible.. thanks guys.:thumbsup:

[EagleMark]

Seems strange that when vehicle is at operating temp it has errors and dies... but you seem to have tested this to a conclusion.

Wonder what would happen if you waited till full operating temp and connected?

What is the ALDL.ds file this $6E uses? I remember one... not sure if this is it... that has 2 data baud rates. one is 160 and the other 8192. The ALDL.ds file would show if I am recalling this correctly and maybe it changes at full temp?

[RobertISaar]

IIRC:

32 is 160 only
32B is 160 and 8192
6E is 160 and 8192

[xtreamvette69]

Seems strange that when vehicle is at operating temp it has errors and dies oh it no longer dies, thats all fine now, TP just loses connection at that point... but you seem to have tested this to a conclusion.

Wonder what would happen if you waited till full operating temp and connected? hmm interesting, i'm betting same thing as when i shut it off to reconnect but idk might be good test

What is the ALDL.ds file this $6E uses? I remember one... not sure if this is it... that has 2 data baud rates. one is 160 and the other 8192. The ALDL.ds file would show if I am recalling this correctly and maybe it changes at full temp?hmm i am not aware of what ALDL.ds file it is or what that even is but i have heard that some if not all use the 160 till it gets signal from scanner/software then goes to 8192 mode

i will tell you more if i understood what your asking, sorry <=== noob at keyboard lol


IIRC:

32 is 160 only
32B is 160 and 8192
6E is 160 and 8192

or that mhmm :rockon:

[Six_Shooter]

Well, I have $12P running on my bench, connects without issue.

[EagleMark]

ALDL.ds files were what GM gave to scanner companies to make scan tools. This is what is used (easy way) to make the TunerPro .adx files.

Pretty sure this is correct for your system. Just open with Notepad.

[RobertISaar]

Well, I have $12P running on my bench, connects without issue.

perhaps warm the 7165 up to the temps xtreamvette69 reported and see if it will get all kinds of flakey?

they seemed like reasonable temperatures for an underhood ECM at least. being mounted in-cabin probably helps keep heat out of it too.

[EagleMark]

Pretty sure the way I read his last test with fan on ECM it was engine temp warmed up that caused the issue. Not a hot ECM.

[RobertISaar]

hmm..... then ~150ish ohm resistor to ground on the coolant temp circuit? that's in the 220*F range.

[EagleMark]

Reading the ALDL.ds file the TP ADX does not follow it at all?

I just made one real quick that does, have no idea if it will work or not... but maybe it will help xtremevette69 follow his new knowledge of ALDL.ds files and TP adx file changes.

[xtreamvette69]

ALDL.ds files were what GM gave to scanner companies to make scan tools. This is what is used (easy way) to make the TunerPro .adx files.

Pretty sure this is correct for your system. Just open with Notepad.
ahh pretty interesting thanks and yep thats how i've heard it described for comunications.

Pretty sure the way I read his last test with fan on ECM it was engine temp warmed up that caused the issue. Not a hot ECM.
yep that is correct at least to the ecm and chip temp seeming to not be the problem, still up in the air if its engine temp or just something that happens about that time or just coincedence as to that being when it always happens.. still more testing to do, fun fun


hmm..... then ~150ish ohm resistor to ground on the coolant temp circuit? that's in the 220*F range.

could try that but ii know that when i had the issue with my ECS maxing before it never disrupted TP, it kept logging it just fine.. so i would say if its engine temp or just temp based it is actual heat and not just reported sensor data doing the disrupting, but i can easily test that again because i dont recall which ecm i was using when i had that issue. think it was with the old one.


Reading the ALDL.ds file the TP ADX does not follow it at all?

I just made one real quick that does, have no idea if it will work or not... but maybe it will help xtremevette69 follow his new knowledge of ALDL.ds files and TP adx file changes.
lol @ new knowledge :rofl:
i will try it out though i will also look through it and see if i can figure what you changed as well... thanks

[xtreamvette69]

umm ok now i am truely puzzled as to what little it must take to effect these ecm's.

totally confussed.. i was just now looking through the diff logs i recorded durring my tests of the elusive TP DA Error that i did today, and something very odd in the first log file that i have never seen before.. ever.
I will post the log but it has alot of jumps/hops/blanks in the logs when viewing monitor view this is my best description.. the log goes normal then like its logging data but its just nothingness(like when reviewing the file paused and moving the scan line accross the page it all goes normal till one of these spots then the scan line skips over it, now keep in mind there are trace lines there but the scan line just wont go onto them but only jumps past them) sound like anything you guys have seen?

anyhow the first one has alot and is the only one i was holding the fan up close to the ecm/chip in, after that for the other logs the fan was still laying there but not as close and certainly not right up to it and the 2nd log only has like one or 2 of these spots and the rest i dont think have any but i was doing alot of playing/adjusting on them so probably hard to notice.
now i already told you about the setup above with the little cooling fan close to and pointing at the ecm and chip(its a small 12v squirral cage fan i can post pic if wanted) anyhow for ease of getting power i have a interior light connector hanging close from the under dash panel that was covering access to the ecm this was where i sourced my power from...

hope that describes it well enough but here is the log and adx i use if anyone wants to take a look, 1st one happens at 1:45-1:46time(M:S) on the mon view. a look is probably worth more then my whole rambling description. to me its bazar but to you guys its probably something you have seen before, tomarrow i will do another log without the fan even hooked up and make sure the weirdness is gone

epdate: logs were taken in the order i list
*log 1 with fan right by ecm/chip had 138 of these things
*log 2 with fan still hooked up and running but laying on floor about 5 inches away had 1 of these things
*log 3 and 4 had none (fan still running and same spot as 2
*log 5 was really short log of just a few revs and shows only one just at the top of a quick rev.

just a querk or should this be telling me something?

[xtreamvette69]

ok so i got bored and took pics, first two are of the fan i used, next one shows about how i was holding it up to the ecm and chip, and the third shows the courtsy light plug i sourced for power and its location..

just figure sometimes alot of error can be seen with pics, if you need to see anything better just ask as all these were hi def large pics that i resized as to not sponder a bunch of of storage space and bandwidth of this site.

[EagleMark]

There's only one log in your post. But that data is not very good. Back to 160 vs 8192 baud, look at the hz reading bottom of TunerPro screen and it's all over the place.

Also if you track Desired AFR in OL it's all over the place and has some glitches...

[xtreamvette69]

There's only one log in your post. thats the one with fan on it, thought that was all that would be needed, i can post others like before and an after if helps But that data is not very good. Back to 160 vs 8192 baud, look at the hz reading bottom of TunerPro screen and it's all over the place.

Also if you track Desired AFR in OL it's all over the place and has some glitches...
mhmm its all glitches, i wasnt watching the logs i was only trying to find the reason for the disconnect but upon reviewing the logs thats what i found lol

so you think fan noise caused that? are these ecms that touchy? if it picks that up i'm thinking there is a great possibility it is picking up something to trigger the disconnects..

here is a log from before the fan testing and one just after the fan testing(the one after still has the fan running but is obout 5" away from ecm.
(caution.. somewhere before/durring or after i changed the timing) im thinking after disconnect though.

hmm desired afr is all glitched on those as well hmm maybe i should try some new files huh? tbh desired afr was one i really never looked at yet.

and all this is why i been scared to take my working old ecm back for core, i'm kinda thinking it worked better then this one after looking back at some logs of that ecm

[EagleMark]

Looks like the log with fan had way more of those dead spots?

[xtreamvette69]

Looks like the log with fan had way more of those dead spots?

yep thats what i was pointing out. 138 of those dead spot/jumped spots to be exact lol, almost like interferance disrupting data flow or something.. i had no idea the ecm would or should be that touchy.. i'm ruling out coincedence as i have never had those jumped dead spots anytime before that fan was there running.. never had a chance today but will get another log asap without the fan running to see if it is gone. if so i will start beliving and thinking maybe i'm getting some sort of static/interferance in my data if ecm is that sensative to just that fan.

[delcowizzid]

the ecus are very sensitive to noise so are aldl cables.thats why they fit resistor spark plugs to efi engines to stop RF interference.over here police cars had different ecu's with extra RF measures to handle all the extra electrical noise created by equipment.

[xtreamvette69]

the ecus are very sensitive to noise so are aldl cables.thats why they fit resistor spark plugs to efi engines to stop RF interference.over here police cars had different ecu's with extra RF measures to handle all the extra electrical noise created by equipment.
ahh thanks might explain alot... dang noise messin with my fun..
*runs off to make a tin foil hat for my ecm* :rofl:

seriously though then just having the metal calpac cover off the ecm could indead allow noise into the system easier as well then? guess i will add electrical noise to my list of problem sources to chase.

[EagleMark]

I always wondered about those ferret beads you put on cables. Moates even has one listed.

[delcowizzid]

there may be an easy fix for the cooling fan making the ecu freak out.have a look at the relay for the fan and see if the wire for fan power into relay pin 30 and power to the trigger coil are tied together.the ecu earths the power to trigger the fan and if they are sharing the same fuse you could be getting some serious noise issues

[RobertISaar]

here's 85:
http://i.imgur.com/SAKu48B.png

and here's 89:
http://i.imgur.com/E0QbjWW.png

[xtreamvette69]

there may be an easy fix for the cooling fan making the ecu freak out.have a look at the relay for the fan and see if the wire for fan power into relay pin 30 and power to the trigger coil are tied together.the ecu earths the power to trigger the fan and if they are sharing the same fuse you could be getting some serious noise issuesthe engine cooling fan is no longer the issue, sorry if was misleading but i was talking about the little fan i was using for a test on the ecm.. the logging errors/disconnects happen even when there is no engine fan running

[xtreamvette69]

here's 85:
http://i.imgur.com/SAKu48B.png

and here's 89:
http://i.imgur.com/E0QbjWW.png
yep cooling fan issue has been fixed, nothing shared just like the picture shows, relay connects through fusable link direct to battery.
the engine cooling fan issue was not causing the logs to stop like the issue i have now, the engine cooling was causing the engine to just quit and ended up being a very bad bin/tune i was trying that a tuner had sent me, guess he was trying to get a customer maybe? i made and burnt a tune and that problem vanished. but thanks guys

[xtreamvette69]

ok time for update.. i got ahold of some time to do some playing and got some logs, now be aware these logs arent intended to show ideal tune abviously lol as i have been playing with alot of things mecanically in an effort to better understand what the ecm does and how it reacts, no better way then hands on right.

i tried not to make too many changes durring these log sessions however i will make you aware of changes if any i did durring these logs.

*log one was done using Marks adx that he posted to try out, it was from a cold start up till disconnect then left log going while i turned off key waited 20-30secs then it resumed. i did however forget to hit the record at the begining of the cold start lol but i can tell you that there were still the same AFR spikes on this as seem on mine.
also toward the ending of this log (i'm sure you can see this) i did unhook the dist wire to check the initial timing.
now a couple things i did notice watching this durring live data was that the HZ at the bottom were lower all accross the board then the others i've made.

*log 2 is a log i did using ADX that had body modified by one as RobertIsaar recomended. ran till disconnect.

*last log was using my same ADX i have been using with the listen for silace added and set at 20, i waited and waited but this one never disconnected and i got tired of waiting for it to so i just disconnected to end it. also somewhere in this log i realised that i had left the tps wrong durring all these so i set it to .55 then realised i ment to set correctly at .54 but didnt bother at this time lol

now the only other possible notable thing was that one of the logs when it error disconnected read only 3.28HZ at the bottom , now i do remember this was one of the first two logs but cant remember which for sure.

[EagleMark]

The ADX I put up for testing has the +1 also. But it has Connect 160 Baud and then Monitor data in 8192 with the 50ms pause as indicated in ALDL.ds file.

So did it get good data without loosing connection? I'm not quite clear on how you worded it?

EDIT: Looked good throughout. No dead spots. Your AIR is coming on and off...

[xtreamvette69]

The ADX I put up for testing has the +1 also. But it has Connect 160 Baud and then Monitor data in 8192 with the 50ms pause as indicated in ALDL.ds file.

So did it get good data without loosing connection? I'm not quite clear on how you worded it? it disconnected at about the same time as all the rest have, although i must note that it did connect instantly unlike the others.(the log just started late as i forgot to hit record but you can see the disconnect as its right before the restart then the end was another disconnect) hope that helps better explain it.

EDIT: Looked good throughout. No dead spots. Your AIR is coming on and off...

AIR? as in air/smog pump or as a/c? i dont have AIR pump but as i said dont see anywhere to shut anything to do with it off, and if a/c then that was off the whole time so idk what you mean?

as for any of those skip/jump type errors, non of these logs have those so in conclusion it was the little fan causing them i'm guessing as amazing as that seems.

[EagleMark]

AIR as in the AIR pump. Just checked on one of your ZZ4 bins you wer uploading to ZEDRATED was turned off by raising temp, but stoick bin is on. There is no XDF parameter for it so I added one.

[xtreamvette69]

ahhh ok i get it now , will check that out .. thanks

great i found it.. will have to see what it does next time i get a chance to experiment.. must be nice to just be able to find and add stuff, some day maybe i will understand enough to do that.. thanks again.

edit: ok so this is the info* i have been going off of but still nice to know that the solinoid activation circuit can be turned off(one less thing for the ecm to be doing)

*AIR delete. The air is only directed to the exhaust manifolds when the engine is warming up and in open loop. The O2 sensor is not used during warm up while the ECM is in open loop. Because of this, there is no need to worry about the offset for the O2.
After warm up and ECM in closed loop, the ECM either directs air to the catalytic converter or diverts it to atmosphere depending on driving and engine conditions.
so to disable/remove AIR, all that is required is to simply disconnect and plug off lines at the exhaust manifolds and converter. Disconnect the 2 plugs on the AIR solenoid valves. Remove the AIR equipment if you so desire. There is nothing that has to be done in the .bin. You could turn the flags off for it, but you don't need to.*

[Six_Shooter]

The issue is that the only code that most of us are familiar with, that is used in the '7165, are $32, $32B and $6E. It could very well be possible that the code itself has connectivity issues.

As an example, I use the '7730/'7749 and have used different codes in them. Looking at my car directly. I have used $59 for years, without issue, quick connectivity and quite solid. There are a few data errors every now and then, but very few. I recently swapped to $58 for some testing and found that at times it takes longer to connect, and data errors are far more frequent. There is a patch that is said to get rid of this (and allow use of an AutoProm), that I haven't tried on my car yet, but have on another car it worked the way it was described. so that points to a code issue.

I will be testing $12P soon, since I am mostly done with the adapter harness.

I forgot where I posted this to be able to update (I searched for a while in a different thread)...

After testing $12P in the '165 ECM, I am even more inclined to say that the ALDL connectivity issues are in the code, and not a hardware issue.

$12P connected solidly and never flaked out. I believe there were the occasional errors, but nothing more than I'm used to on other code in other ECMs.

[delcowizzid]

ive logged $12p for over 60 minutes of driving in one hit no errors even while emulating down the aldl connection at the same time as logging its solid LOL

[EagleMark]

So you guys never have data issues with $12p ?

That would kill the theory of it being hit or miss with ECM.

[delcowizzid]

do you have any other equipement on the 8192 aldl bus BCM ABS etc in these cars you are working with

[EagleMark]

I don't know the exact cars well enough to say for sure, but cars of that era here didn't have other modules, I think the Caddilac did.

Here's another issue pointing towards a code or hardware issue. Look at bold print! Are 85-86 cars having the issue? 87-98 cars or ECM not having issue?

DATA STREAM A28 SPECIFICATION

ENGINE USAGE:
5.0L PFI CPC - (LB9) - (F) - 87,88 (160 & 8192 baud)
5.0L PFI CPC - (LB9) - (F) - 86 (160 baud only)
5.7L PFI CPC - (L98) - (8) - 87,88 (160 & 8192 baud)
5.7L PFI CPC - (L98) - (8) - 85,86 (160 baud only)

DATA PIN : READ DATA ON PIN "E" OF ALDL CONNECTOR

BAUD RATE : 8192

MODES : DATA STREAM ATTACHED FOR ALDL MODE 1

THESE ENGINES USE A 'HYBRID' ECM, AND THE 8192 DATA
COMMUNICATIONS OCCUR ON ALDL PIN 'E'
Serial data shall be unidirectional from the ECM to a connected
device at 160 baud when the ECM is not in the ALDL mode. When the
ECM is in the ALDL mode (10k), the ECM shall transmit the normal
25 parameter ALDL list at the 160 baud rate. The ECM shall then
be moded to listen for a period of 50 ms for an inbound message
from an ALDL test device at an 8192 baud rate. If a valid message
is received, communications shall continue at an 8192 baud rate
until a power down reset. Otherwise, the ECM shall be moded for
160 baud, transmit the 25 parameter ALDL list and then listen for
50 ms for an 8192 baud inbound message.
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